wrote:
From: "K4YZ" on Thurs 13 Oct 2005 18:49

wrote:
From: Dave Heil on Thurs, Oct 13 2005 8:19 am
wrote:
Dee Flint wrote:

Movies and novels, etc often take artistic license with the facts in order
to produce more impact. That is true of both dramas and comedies. So any
one who relies on such items for their history is going to be using a far
amount of misinformation. Even the news media takes artistic license by the
selection of what facts and speculation to report since they are going for
ratings.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Dee, excellent, excellent post.

That must be why some in this group constantly quote british comedy as
if it were somehow relevant to matters at hand. They get their history
from Monty Python. Telling is their admiration for the contribution(s)
that the ARS made in WWII. Quitepuzzling, since the ARS was shut down
by the US government at the time.

Many radio amateurs made their war contributions as radio operators.

As did all the PCTAs in here, valiantly fighting the brave
fight with a morse key in each holster.

Scumbag Lennie, ressurected from wherever it is he and Mrs Lennie
slither off to on occassion.....

"Scumbag?" "...slither?" :-)

Well, a three-week trip to a college reunion might look like that
to one who has only been "licensured" as a high school graduate.

Can you be sure of that?

BTW, "occasion" has only one S in it...

Mr. Spelling Bee messed up?

And of course, it's for no other purpose except to "make ugly" in
RRAP.

Tsk, tsk, tsk...I didn't write "scumbag" or "slither." :-)

...or "sign off" with the Yiddish pejorative "Putz." :-)

Welp, I knew Steve wasn't up to the task of turning over the forest of
leaves that it would take for him to act pleasant on RRAP. It just
isn't in his nature.

It would be fun to read of their stories, tales of heroism,
etc., while working for the OSS deep behind the lines and
sending intel back to Hq. I can compare them to those I
heard back in the 1950s from Signalmen who were actually
there!

I imagine that most of what you re-tell here is already from bar
room tales you over heard, Lennie...

What "tales" have I told, masterradiooperator? :-)

Being assigned to a major Army radio station of the 1950s? Was
all true. Documented. I have not only witenesses but those
witnesses were there at the same time I was. HF. Radio. KW
power levels. 220 thousand messages relayed per month.

http://kauko.hallikainen.org/history...s/My3Years.pdf

Dudly the Imposter has "ZERO-POINT-ZERO" experience as a
military radio operator. Zip. Nada. Nyet. None.

[unless one counts undocumented, unreferencible "Assistant NCOIC"
claims at a MARS station...:-)]

I'm skeptical.

Many became electronics and radio instructors.

Right...and how MANY is "many?" More than five?

According to ARRL numbers from the era (yeah...we know,
Lennie..NOTHING the ARRL says is true...We've heard your lies
before...) over 6000 licensed Amateurs of the era served IN UNIFORM
during WW2.

...and don't you wish YOU were, mighty warrior? :-)

Steve envies many things.

Dudly the Imposter says "I told 'lies'" yet cannot prove it.

Dudly the Ugly mouths off again.

I can't classify him as ugly, but pudgy seems to fit that photo he
brandishes on QRZ.

Was the MIT Radiation Lab built up on a base of amateurs?

Does it matter? I'll bet there were a few there.

Tsk. You don't even know what "rad lab" is or stands for or
where it was located during WW2...

I'd like to see him suprise you on that one. Probably lots of N2EY,
W3RV, and K4CAP back channel going on right now.

Were there NO electronics professionals anywhere in the U.S.
electronics industry at that time?

Are you suggesting that NONE of the "electronics professionals" of
the era were licensees, Lennie?

"Licensees" of what, masterradiooperator? :-)

Motor Vehicle Ops?

What do you think Bell Labs in NJ had? A little shack
just working on telephones?

Again...No Amateurs there either, Lennie? Not a one?

Quote from the ARRL Holy Book, masterradiooperator, and tell us
EXACTLY how many. You imply you KNOW all. :-)

BTW, do you know WHERE "Bell Labs" were in WW2, masterradiooperator?

More back channel...

What about the second-highest priority of manufacture in
World War 2, right behind the Manhattan Project? That was
quartz crystal unit manufacture...a million a month in the
last three years of WW2.

Bet there was a couple there, too...

Only a "couple?" :-)

Probably inductively coupled.

Which of the more than 30 companies involved had licensed
radio amateurs, Dudly the Ugly?

The civilian center for quartz crystal unit production was
Motorola in Chicago in WW2. Except you said that Motorola
didn't exist back then, remember? :-)

Oooh! Ouch!

Many were involved in radio design and manufacture.

Riiiight...all hams knew everything there was to know about
radar, microwaves, sonobuoys, VHF and UHF radio relay, and
primitive television used in the first guided bombs?

So...We have NO persons working in ANY electronics venue in WW2,
Lennie?

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Dudly the Ugly has very little reading
comprehension. I don't know who the "we" are, but what you
say I wrote isn't what I wrote.

"Electronics venue?" What are you talking about? "Venue?"

Next to the bratwurst venue on radio row?

Locate Lewyt Vacuum Cleaner Comapny and find out their
history...they built lots of BIG HF transmitters during
WW2! Really. BC-339s with 1 KW RF out in HF and BC-340s
with 10 KW RF out in HF. Said so on lots of nameplates.

OK.

Your point?

Tsk, good opportunity for Dudly the Ugly to say that "vacuum
cleaners 'suck'!" [missed your chance, Dud]

Probably manage to get "Putz" in there.

Many became involved with Civil Defense
and WERS (War Emergency Radio Service).

Again, how MANY is "many?"

More than are licensed in the Amateur service on Lanark, Lennie...

Tsk, tsk. Three of us living on Lanark Street are licensed
by the FCC in COMMERCIAL radio service. But, "Lanark Street"
didn't exist before 1950 so that doesn't fit with Dudly the Ugly's
personal hatred of certain folks in here...:-)

Wonder what commercial "licensure" Steve has?

Were there any AIR ATTACKS on the
United States then? [exactly one case of a Japanese
submarine firing a couple rounds on California, hitting very
little] [Hawaii wasn't a state back then, remember]

Why?

What does licensure in WERS have to do with air attacks?

Tsk, tsk, tsk, Dud, you'd best get with Buzziebaby on those
"air attacks." He say over 200 Japanese balloons "attacked"
the US of A in WW2. Were there NO "balloon spotters" manned
by "licensured" radio amateurs back then? :-)

Theodolite tracked balloon bombs?

My father-in-law was an "air raid warden" in his neighborhood
some 900+ miles inland from the east coast, about 2000 miles
inland from the west coast. About all that was accomplished
with those air raid drills was conservation of electricity
by turning off all non-essential lights.

So?

Again, just wondering what this may have to do with Amatuers
having performed some service in WW2.

Tsk, tsk, tsk, I wonder what Dudly the Ugly had to do with
WW2 considering he didn't exist until a decade AFTER WW2
ended. :-)

Welp, he knows that Jim said...

Tell us all about CD and WERS, old timer. I'm sure the kids
in here will glory in your stories. I was a kid myself back
then and thought it real exciting to hear all those stories
of military life.

Civil Defense and WERS were not "military", Lennie. They were
civilian, hence the "C" in "CD".

Tell us all about it, old-timer. You were THERE, weren't you? :-)

Fly your "E for Effort" flag proudly, masterradiooperator. :-)

[anyone alive during WW2 could see the "E flags"]

Some folks will do anything to hang on to another's contributions...

There is a large amount of
documentation of the efforts of radio amateurs during the Second World
War. Have you read any of it?

Lots and lots of it available from the ARRL. Too bad they don't
mention all the NON-amateur contributions in radio...(SNIP)

Why should they?

Tsk, tsk, tsk...you never saw any "war surplus radio" stuff?

Old-timer, you've lead a sheltered life.

The radio-electronics INDUSTRY of the USA built all those "surplus
radios" from WW2. Those were NOT built FOR radio amateurs.

They weren't made expressly for radio row?

How many articles about Amateur Radio appear in IEEE publications?

Over a dozen that I've seen...but the IEEE, a PROFESSIONAL
ASSOCIATION publishes not only SPECTRUM (the membership magazine
I get free each month), but the PROCEEDINGS (technical features
on both electric power and general electronic subjects) plus over
two dozen TRANSACTIONS (from special interest groups) each month.
Not only that, they publish (generally printed by Wiley) books
and biographies and historical texts on electric and electronic
subjects. Go to their website and check out what's available.

That would require effort.

Tsk, Dudly the Ugly has to understand that "radio" is only one
small subset of the entirety of ELECTRONICS in the world. To
the vast majority of IEEE members, "amateur radio" is just a
hobby for personal recreation and enjoyment. The world of
electronics hasn't looked to amateurism to supply new insights
and principles for well over a half century...worldwide.

They're oiling up the Wrenchy Stitch for such blasphemy.

(UNSNIP)...or even
that the major communications mode of the U.S. military back in
WW2 was by TTY, not morse code...as it continued into the post-
War Two period. Western Electric Company made lots and lots of
NON-morse communications equipment...they of the Bell conglomerate
and not at all being amateur about what they did.

Still nothing here that suggests that anything Dave (nor anyone
else, for that matter...) said was incorrect.

Tsk, tsk, Dud, listen to Davie the Heil...he "worked with NASA"
and did "real radio operating" while in uniform. You have
exactly "zero-point-zero" experience in military communications.

It would appear that way. Steve is free to correct the record at any
time.

But...the ARRL is the "only true" source of "radio history" isn't
it? Always "telling the truth" and omitting nothing, right?

Geeze, Lennie, no one except YOU suggested that.

Riiiiight...and the ARRL is "universally loved" by all "licensured"
radio amateurs! :-)

ARRL *always* "tells the truth" and never omits mention of
hated professionals, right? :-)

ARRL *never* "sins by omission" do they? :-)

Such as omitting Carl from the ballot...

Just more proof of my theory that your misdeeds, mistruths and
deceit in this forum is a hate-fest against the ARRL due to some
perceived sleight that was dealt you in the past...

Poor baby, being delusional again? :-)

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Trying to get rid of the amateur radio morse
code test in FCC regulations is NOT "hating the ARRL or 'all'
radio amateurs."

Ahem... (there's a large subset of amateurs that believe so)

Tell us your stories, old timer. They are always such a treat
on how you saved the country for democracy during WW2.

Gee, Lennie...You're alsways the one with a "Back in the war..."
story for us...Usually a pages-long ranting on the equipment line-up at
ADA and how YOU single-handedly passed 1.2 million messages....

So, old-timer, WHICH military radio station did YOU work at
"during the war?" :-)

Probably too busy with those "seven hostile actions" to notice the
callsign or routing indicators.

...and WHICH "war" was it? You've never detailed that, Dudly
the Imposter. You've made only inferences, nothing detailed.

It's all hush hush, on the QT, need to know basis.

He'd have to kill you if found out.

Then you can insert the "PCTA truth" of how "all" radio ops
"must know morse code" in order to be "good radio ops" and how
anyone that doesn't love, honor, cherish and obey the morse
creed is "hating all hams" of today. [which is what it will all
boil down to...as usual]

Or it will "all boil down to" Lennie Anderscum ranting and raving
about how Amateurs know nothing, and that anyone not collecting a
paycheck for thier activites in "radio" are underachievers.

"their," sweetums...watch those typos when you get heated. :-)

"Anderson" "thier"

Tsk, tsk, tsk...I've not said that "all amateurs" "know nothing."

I've said that CERTAIN INDIVIDUAL AMATEURS are IGNORANT of
anything but being able to read (word-for-word) every ad in QST
to get their "radio smarts." That's (unfortunately) true.

That YOU are an UNDERACHIEVER is YOUR label for YOURSELF.

That YOU are HATING of anyone who has gathered experience
in radio operating anywhere but as a "licensured" amateur
is YOUR problem.

His problems number so many as to be insurmountable.

Have Jimmie Noserve tell us all about Washington Army Radio
[WAR callsign] at Fort Detrick and how ACAN operated. He will
know because he thinks he was THERE or something. Have Dudly
tell us about the Montezuma halls and the beaches of Tripoli
as he valiantly fought side by side with other ham heroes in
the African campaign of '43. Wonderful stories and tales!

Funny...

All of the "wonderful stories and tales" come from you, Lennie...

Tsk, tsk, tsk. Jimmie once mentioned some old-timer's article
about WAR (Washington Army Radio) from pre-WW2 times and tried
to discredit the FACT that WAR was running TTY, not morse code,
during and after WW2. Washington Army Radio had the TTY
four-letter ID of "RUEP" in ACAN...ADA has "RUAP." [you need
more of the ACAN IDs, old-timer? I got them up to 1962]

Always enjoy WAR stories from "them that didn't."

Long ago in here some anony-mouse "reserve colonel" had a "son
in the [first] Gulf War" that was using "CW behind enemy lines
to send intel back to Hq." [his son would 'never' lie to him
he wrote] Anony-mouse slunk away when confronted with modern
land-forces radio equipment nomenclature and procedure, his last
posting saying he might have been mistaken. :-)

Ouch.

[Dudly the Imposter has NEVER mentioned one single nomenclature
or familiar name of any military radio communication equipment
(other than a couple MARS radios) yet claimes to "know" about
military communications]

Is the intercom on a helicopter considered "radio?"

HF radio was ONCE a mainstay of international radio communications
but that reverted to a backup system some time in the 1970s with
the coming of more modern methods of reaching around the globe.
That's the REAL HISTORY of radio communications to the REST of
the radio world.

Frankly, Dud, you know dink about radio communications other than
what you read about in ARRL pages. You've got a BIG problem of
sociopathy in newsgroups, always personally insulting anyone
who disagrees with you. Take your standard "sign off" as an
example:

Putz.

Dudly the Ugly tries to strike again...and fails. Oy, gevalt!

Acting Ugly with all who disagree with you is NOT good PR for
U.S. amateur radio...and you SO identify yourself with ALL of
amateur radio that the slightest negative against YOU personally
gets translated to some kind of "insult to all amateurs!"

It doesn't work that way.

He tries so hard to make it so.



How was the reunion?