beerbarrel wrote...
"I think we killed more than 20000 of those *******s....hopefully we
will get even more."


wow, this swerved way off...from UPS service to taxes to the war....totally
off topic, sorry, just went down this path I have to say my last...

*******s? most of the dead did nothing against us... ever. They just got
in the way. You can be sure that their relatives want to hurt us, now!
Why is it everyone else is an enemy until you meet them and realize they are
human, just like us, they want to live and be prosperous. They have
children, mothers, and fathers. A smaller group has taken up arms against
us... and, for reasons you might agree with if you were there.

Religion teaches there is absolute good and absolute evil, and thats what W
and the other nuts that lead us into this believe. Big trouble, there.
Well, guess what. No person, no country, no movement, just like no radio,
is absolutely good or bad. There are very good reasons some of those Iraqis
are against us. If you were raised there you might understand that. But
rather than fix that, we made it worse. REmember, this war has NOTHING to
do with Al Queida, except they like that we are wasting our time while we
weaken ourselves and disaster recovery efforts.

IF you could ask an insurgent why he's shooting, the # 1 answer is to
protect his country from the invaiders, the "evil" USA. OK, that's not
the smartest thought, but , thats what he believes. Hmm. If we werent
there, the shooting would decrease. Yes, there will be some other war, now
that we stirred the pot, but it has nothing to do with us. They gotta sort
that out. No country is gonna be safe because of us.

Hmmm. The "Coalition of the Willing? ... guess thats like putting up a
sign that says "watch out for this sign".

Not to mention the wounded, suffering slowly with no medical facilities,
no one to help. Starving because they cant work and because we have
destroyed what little support systems there were. Imagine that in your own
neighborhood. Just try. War is hell, just ask any soldier.

You DO understand that the Iraqi citizens never plotted to attack the USA,
and had NO connection to Al Quieda. Too bad W , and much of the USA hawk
populus still doesnt understand this. There was a nutcase leader. IF we
needed to remove him, we could have done that pretty surgically, and not
shot up and bombed the whole country. Remember, Saddam's followers
deserted after his fall. They were ready to sign up with the new president,
or whoever pays their salary, but we botched that up and let massive looting
break out.

When's the last time you heard W say "weapons of mass destruction"? Seems
thats all he could say in 2002... kept at it. All the experts, and other
national leaders, said, no. Well, Kim Jong Il sure has them.... hey,
lets bomb him! Pre-emptive strike, right?

George Sr. knew these problems. At least he had some foreign experience.
He tried to talk W out of it, like he did Cheney and Rummy way back when.
Dad turns out to be a genius next to W.

Thats why our real enemies are succeeding. They know we will never take
the time to understand our enemies. We like to shoot first and think later.
That is why we will never "win" another war, including this mess.

Meanwhile, the extremists everywhere else are laughing in joy at our
failure, and why we are going to suffer further attacks for many many years
to come.

For how long Cheney and Rumsfeld were planning this, you'd think it was put
together by some second grade art class.

Think back to Vietnam.... what great positive change did we make in the
world... while spending 50+ of our guys and how many $$$? "We defeated
Communism!"
Uh, I dont think so. It eventually defeated itself 20 years later.

Some wars are just, or at least have furthered our cause. WW2, we stopped a
madman. He rose to power because of injust WW1 sanctions against Germany,
but thats another story. Gulf war, we stopped a madman, and created
another (Osama + Al Queida).

I'm done here. Too depressing...Back to our usual on topic discussions....


Mark Oppat


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