On Mar 4, 4:53�pm, wrote:
On Mar 4, 6:56 pm, "Dee Flint" wrote:





wrote in message

roups.com...

On Mar 4, 11:38 am, "Dee Flint" wrote:
wrote in message

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On Mar 4, 10:25 am, "Dee Flint" wrote:
wrote in message

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On Mar 4, 9:10 am, "Dee Flint" wrote:
"KH6HZ" wrote in message

...

[snip]

As I see it, there simply is no longer a need for an "entry level"
license.

Why not?

As I suspected, and Len asserted, "It's all about Morse Code" with
some of you's guys.

Not at all. *There is such a wide range of enjoyable activities available
that I want people to be able to explore them. *For the same reason
(expanding one's range of activities and knowledge base), I've dragged
Extra
class licensees over to the VHF station at Field day to show them what
can
be achieved on those frequencies. *While there are many Extras familiar
with
the VHF/UHF possibilities, for some reason the Extras in the club I
belong
to it have not really explored them.

I was referrign to Code Testing.

Not relevant to anything I have said in this thread. *It is not about code
testing but about each of us "being all that we can be".

...an army of one. *Try to keep up with the changes.

Salute! :-)

The
only "break" is that you end up taking one written test of 50 questions
instead of two tests of 40 and 50 questions for a total of 90 questions.
Today's Extra exam has an 800+ question pool to select from for that 50
question test.

Miccolis has covered this...

I thought I had?

For the new QP with the General set to start on 1 Jul 07 there
are a total of 1679 questions for all three writtens. Since only
120 questions make up all three, the number of possible test
questions are in a ratio of 13.99:1. That is MORE than the
10 minimum required in FCC regulations.

The Extra class exam (50 questions) has a ratio of 16.04:1
pool to required, new General 13.86:1, Techinician that
began in January is 11.20:1.

Just thought I'd toss that into the maelstrom. :-)

73, LA

not pushing it toward an MSEE like some of you would like to
think.

I've never made that assertion nor implied it. *That MSEE has to learn a
whole lot more than was ever covered in the Amateur radio exams.

Are you an MSEE?

*So if there is so little difference between the Technician and
General Exams, and the Extra has been dumbed down to Advanced level,
why do we still have people wanting more superfluous license classes
that are growing closer together in difficulty allatime?

I did not say there is so little difference between the Tech and General.

I believe you did, but will accept that is not what you meant (unless
you say it again).

Merely that it is reasonable for a person to study to go to General either
right at the beginning or shortly thereafter.

That would be known as the "Old General." *They were split in the
Spring of 1987.

Nor has the Extra been dumbed down to the Advanced class. *

Sure it has.

If you were to
talk to any of the people who earned their Extra under the pre-2000 system,
they will tell you that the Advanced class written test was the hardest of
all the writtens. *

It was. *I took and passed both.

So the Extra was already dumbed down, and now it is combined with a
lower class pool...

Sounds really, really dumbed down now.

That is where the bulk of the difficult technical
material was. *The Extra class test addressed more detailed knowledge of the
rules, regs, what it takes to be a VE,

My opinion is that the VEC needs to cover being a VE, not a
additional, superfluous license class.

and a small amount of technical
material. *

A very small amount.

When the system was changed, all the material for both the
Advanced and Extra went into the new Extra question pool

Which is why it's dumbed down.

And in the end, it's still allabout Morse Code with you.

That conclusion is not based on any of the opinions I have expressed in this
thread or any other.

Dee, it's based upon all of the opinions that you express.





In the exam sessions, we actively encourage a person to try the
General when they pass the Tech exam. *Those applicants that have chosen
to
develop an understanding of the Tech material (i.e. learn the antenna
equation and how to use it rather than memorizing the lengths for the
questions that might occur on the test) usually come within a couple of
points of passing the General. *Some would have passed the General if
they
had simply known to also memorize the General frequency priviliges along
with the material they already knew.

Did you say memorize? *Wouldn't you rather they understood the
frequency privileges?

I don't bother getting involved with that discussion as most just try to
twist it to suit their own purposes. *There is some material that must be
memorized just as frequencies and equations. *Other things must be
understood as to when and how to use those equations.

Fair enough, but I had to bring it up.

The material on the Tech and General is straight forward enough that it
can
be grasped by just about anyone with a moderate amount of study. *If one
looks at it in terms of return (license & range of privileges) versus
investment (study), the General is perfectly reasonable as a first
license
step.

All government testing should be straight forward.

All of the testing is straight forward. *The Extra is merely difficult not
convoluted.

So all of the matierial is straight forward? *Good.





On the other hand, let's look at an "entry level" license and exam. *You
have got to cover rules, safety (including RF radiation safety), and good
operating practices as a bare minimum. *By the time you do this, you've
already got a significant portion of what you would need for a General
class
license. *Your return (license & privileges) versus investment (study)
for
an entry level license, is just not that worthwhile.

If you remove the RF Safety, and change the power levels below that
required for an RFEA, then you have the makings of a simplified
amateur class.

Why should anybody even bother with such a limited license? *It would be so
limited people would get bored and drop out or immediately upgrade. *Not
worth the investment of time.

Not children, not scouts. *I guess we don't want to attract newcomers
for a lifetime of amateur radio, just the retirees.

Those countries that have folded their two license classes into one class
often had a written test that was equivalent to our Extra not our General
for both and the only differentiating item was the code test. *Thus they
really had no "entry" license.

I wasn't allowed to talk about Japan. *You shouldn't be allowed to
talk about anonymous countries.

Never said one wasn't allowed to talk about Japan. *Merely pointed out the
invalidity of trying to compare the systems.

Invalidity?



They had VHF/UHF licenses and full licenses.
The US has been somewhat unusual in that there is a license (General)
that
has a significant range of privileges on all bands with a moderate level
level of testing.

Dee, N8UZE-

The General once conveyed ALL AMATEUR PRIVILEGES.

Sheesh!

And the