JJ wrote:
Brian Hill wrote:

"exray" wrote in message Thanks...

The cost of doing business comes directly out of profits. Thats the way
it works for any vendor or merchant. You can't take 100% of the income
and insist that the buyer pick up the tab for your business costs.
In that light, the manner of presentation DOES matter.
What if a buyer sez, well ok-I'll mail a money order and then wants to
hit you with HIS costs of doing business like 37c postage and 85c for
the money order? You wouldn't think very highly of him as a buyer would
you?

-Bill



I'm going with it. I can see it isn't popular. I was just looking at
it like
this.

Lets say a $50 radio okay and the total cost. This is just a quick
guess.

So the buyer gives me $50
-Pay Pal 2.9 %+.30c=$48.25
- packing materiels $8=$40.25
- Ebay list fees $2.50=$37.75
then final value fee( say -$2)= $35.75
Then time packing and driving to the PO+Gas-$5=$30.75
and the radio is still worth $50


That is the chance you take with an auction, it could have gone for $20
or $200. If a item sells for less than you think it is worth, do you
think you should be able to make it up in other fees?

Golly, it breaks me heart to hear how the sellers on ebay can't make money.

More things to add in:

Cost of electricity to operate the computer.

Computer depreciation.... you guys ARE depreciating your computers
aren't you? And the way computers depreciate, you lose money.

Toilet paper when that no-reserve item sells for so low that you crap
yourself. 8^)

Printer paper, ink , etc.

A couple final thoughts:

If you have costs, you factor them into what you are doing, and don't
bore the customer with them. I don't want to hear the person I'm buying
something whining about the cost of packing material.

If ebay is such a profitless venture, bring that 50 dollar radio to a
hamfest, and pay the 5 bucks or whatever for the table. Yeah, I know, it
costs for the gas, and sandwidges and sodas.....

- Mike KB3EIA -

"exray" wrote in message
...
Brian Hill wrote:



No I just said Hallicrafters World Wide Like Zenith TO. I wasn't trying
to
be sneaky. Its Hallicrafters version of the TO. Hallicrafters are just
as
poular as Zenith and sell them selves on their own merit.


I just stated it
because a lot of people like to collect the differant makes of those
style
radios. I can see how some would use tactics like that though.


I don't mean any offense, Brian, but the TO gang are a severe bunch.
Any radio nowadays that has a handle on top gets to be a TO clone or
companion model just by rights of appearing to be a similar suitcase
radio because well, they have a handle on top.
I personally have no affinity for radios with handles on top but many do
and they can be cutthroat when their favorite is compared to some other
'lesser' radio with a handle on top.


As far as the paypal thing, how would you like it

Been there already.

I figure some wacko pegged you on the quasi-TO thing plus the Paypal
issue and some 19 year old kid in San Jose was pressed for a decision
and he did what any idiot would do.

Relist the thing and up the minimum by 2.90 so as to cover your Pal Pay
and hide the word "zenith" well inside the text so the TO guys won't be
offended.

-BM

Dito

"exray" wrote in message You say $30.75 to
pack and deliver to the PO. Are you hiring? I'll move
to Bum****, MN and pack all your stuff and go to the PO for $20/whack
giving you a 66% cost saving.....or is that not what you meant?

-BM

LOL! is all I can say. 73

Brian Hill wrote:
I was just looking at it like
this.

Lets say a $50 radio okay and the total cost. This is just a quick guess.

So the buyer gives me $50
-Pay Pal 2.9 %+.30c=$48.25
- packing materiels $8=$40.25
- Ebay list fees $2.50=$37.75
then final value fee( say -$2)= $35.75
Then time packing and driving to the PO+Gas-$5=$30.75
and the radio is still worth $50


Please don't take this as a rant:

I think you need to start considering PayPal a "value added" service.
They add value to your item. In my (very non-scientific) research (I've
been on ebay since early 96, when they were still called AuctionWeb) I
truly think they add more than enough value to pay for the service. The
radio you note above at a $50 sales price might only bring $40 if you
don't have that Paypal logo on your auction. I know I will NOT bid on
an item if the seller doesn't take Paypal (unless it's rare and I really
really want it). I know there are lots and lots of people that feel the
same way. I buy and sell quite a bit on ebay, and I truly believe the
value of the paypal logo far outweighs the cost.

Good luck and 73,

Dave
--
David Ragsdale
San Luis Obispo, CA 93407

"exray" wrote in message
...


You say $30.75 to pack and deliver to the PO. Are you hiring? I'll move
to Bum****, MN and pack all your stuff and go to the PO for $20/whack
giving you a 66% cost saving.....or is that not what you meant?

-BM


read carefully: $5 for delivery

then final value fee( say -$2)= $35.75
Then time packing and driving to the PO + Gas - $5 = $30.75

$35 - 5 = $30


--
Steve N, K,9;d, c. i My email has no u's.

On Sun, 30 May 2004 12:22:36 -0600, JJ
wrote:

In your title or description did you say something like "not zenith
transoceanic", or "not like zenith transoceanic"? If so, that is keyword
spaming so that when someone searches on zenith transoceanic they get a
hit on your set which is not a zenith T/O, which is pretty sneaky at
best. As far as the paypal thing, how would you like it if every time
you use your visa or mastercard the merchant adds the credit card
percentage he pays to the price of the product.

Actually they used to. Then the CC companies forbade it in
their merchant contracts -- everyone had to be offered the same price
so the card companies wouldn't be at a perceived price disadvantage.
Hence, in covering his CC costs, the merchants collected frpom
everyone regardless. For a while, some gas stations offered a
discounted cash price, but that didn't last long either. I do notice
that Exxon stations in California still manage to add on a fifty or
seventy-five cent surcharge for non-cash purchases. No idea what the
legal status of that one is.

Bet you would really
scream. Ebay makes it very plain in their rules about the above
infractions so you really have no reason to cry. Why should the merchant
be gouged for having a convient way for you to pay?

"exray" wrote in message
...

Exactly the point. They are being paid for already as "cost of doing
business" so the merchant need not ask you for more.



I have the right to refuse PayPal due to their charges. If someone INSISTS
then I have the right to refuse their business or ask for reimbursement of
the charges.

I ran a substantial mail order business and some people wanted to come and
pick up their orders. Not only did I not charge them shipping, but I gave
them a 5% discount because they were not using our shipping "resources"
which were normally built into the product price.

My objection is that PayPal/eBay wants to control my freedom of speech by
telling me what I can and cannot say. I prefer full disclosure and let the
buyer make their own decision. Of course, this hurts them as then everyone
sees that they raise the cost of doing business (regardless of the merits of
their service).

Brian Hill wrote:



I'm going with it. I can see it isn't popular. I was just looking at it like
this.

Lets say a $50 radio okay and the total cost. This is just a quick guess.

So the buyer gives me $50
-Pay Pal 2.9 %+.30c=$48.25
- packing materiels $8=$40.25
- Ebay list fees $2.50=$37.75
then final value fee( say -$2)= $35.75
Then time packing and driving to the PO+Gas-$5=$30.75
and the radio is still worth $50

I guess you could charge shipping and handling? Thats withing Ebay guide
lines. I never charge for packing materiel and they are expensive or at the
least take time and money to find. And Bill you know what it takes to
properly pack a radio. So how would you go about handling cost?



The bidder thought it was worth $50 plus P&P. That's what he offered
and what you accepted. The fact you live miles from the PO and drive
a gas guzzler and have to pay E-bay, PayPal & co. and are not much
good a scrounging packing is not the buyers problem. If you think
the radio or whatever is not worth selling at $50 (you get $30) then
you should have put a higher reserve on it. E-bay rules are clear and
fair. You know what you're getting into. If you don't want to sell at
the price bid then don't offer to. Your error is in thinking that you
are going to make a profit of the final bid price. For sure the buyer
didn't bid you an extra $20 for fees and stuff. And don't tell us you
never had an item go 2 or 3 times what you thought you'd get. Would
you offer the buyer a refund because of that? Thought not.

The buyer pays, E-bay gets some, PayPal gets some, USPS gets some,
IRS gets some, you get what's left. That's how it works. You could
certainly add something for packing and handling but you should
really put that up-front in the item description. You know in
advance what it will cost you to pack. Then add shipping at cost.
Something like "Packing and Handling $10.00. Shipping at cost by
USPS/UPS/etc." You really have to let the buyer know what he's
getting into and stick to E-bay's rules is all.

best

Andy, M1EBV

exray wrote in message ...
Brian Hill wrote:

I don't see why I have to be gouged twice by Ebay and PayPal for
offering a
conveinant way to pay. Gezz only they can charge for everthing I guess? Like
buyers can't read and make up there own mind.

It cuts both ways. A normal operating business considers expenses like
that as part of doing business. As a customer I would be outraged if I
went to a merchant and they charged me extra because I chose some
particular form of payment.

-BM


They did it at the gas pumps... you would get a discount if you paid by cash.

"Brian Hill" wrote in message ...

No I just said Hallicrafters World Wide Like Zenith TO. I wasn't trying to
be sneaky. Its Hallicrafters version of the TO. Hallicrafters are just as
poular as Zenith and sell them selves on their own merit. I just stated it
because a lot of people like to collect the differant makes of those style
radios. I can see how some would use tactics like that though.

Don't put it in your title. Put it in your description. When you put
it in your title, and some whiny do-gooder or, someone selling the
same item who hates your competition sees it, the can report it as
keyword spamming, and ebay will pull your ad. It's important to
realize that Ebay never finds these on their own, they only become
aware of them when some loser reports them. Then they pull them.