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#31
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On Feb 29, 9:14�pm, Klystron wrote:
wrote: Klystron wrote: But what if they are transporting several people - say, a young family that was in a serious auto accident? Or suppose they were transporting desperately-needed medicines, blood, etc., during an epidemic? If you want to COMMANDEER something, re-read my previous post. It doesn't matter if there are 99 people in the ambulance, they are all having heart attacks and the ambulance is on fire. However, if the ambulance breaks down, they can't commandeer your car. For a government agency to seize private property (a category that includes repeaters, transceivers, etc.) for their own use, they must have a declaration of emergency, declaration of martial law, or, in individual cases, a court order. I'm not sure what the ultimate legality is, in a case like that or the others I described. I suspect that government folks would not seize private property for emergency use unless they were desperate, because of the possible liability. � �Look for definitions of terms like "declaration of emer gency," "martial law" or "disaster area." This is heavily traveled territory - we don't need to reinvent the wheel, here in this newsgroup. The main point is that there has to be a clear and defined life-and- death emergency. But there's also the point of who can declare an emergency? Can the EMTs say that the ambulance breakdown is an emergency? OTOH, would you want to have it on your conscience that a person or a family died because you wouldn't let the ambulance folks use your car when it was desperately needed? � �See bottom paragraph. OK I don't think the FD person wanted the repeaters. He said they could use the frequencies, not the repeaters. And the frequencies are public property, after all. An amateur or club might own the repeater but they don't own the frequencies. This makes it a completely different situation from the commandeering of private property. Further complicating the situation is the fact that many if not most amateur radio repeaters aren't installed on the owner's property. � �If you put your shoes in a locker at the gym, are they still YOUR shoes? Of course - but if someone needed them in a life-and-death emergency.... There's also the question of contract provisions as part of the rental agreement. Shoes in a locker are different from permanently installed radio equipment requiring power and radiating RF. Like the situation of the broken-down ambulance, would any radio amateur want it on his/her conscience that a building burned down, and/ or people died, because s/he wouldn't let the emergency service people use an amateur radio repeater in an emergency when it was desperately needed? � �There is a bit of difference between a civic minded ama teur radio club voluntarily making its facilities available and a government employee with an inflated sense of entitlement believing that he can seize whatever he wants to seize whenever he want to seize it because fires and sick people in ambulances are really, really important. Of course - but what if the emergency really does meet K2ASP's double- prong test? That is, it's a real life-and-death emergency, and there are no other facilities available that can do the job? As KB9X points out, the quoted person who said "everything we do is life-and-death" was way out of line, and not representative at all. But what about real-life situations that meet the two-prong test? Granted they are very rare, and most of us will never encounter them, but the time to think about them is before they happen. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
#32
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On Sat, 01 Mar 2008 01:05:35 -0500, Phil Kane wrote:
On Fri, 29 Feb 2008 10:20:00 EST, Klystron wrote: It is not as simple as that. What constitutes an emergency? Gee, let's open that can of worms once again! It's a two-prong test - it has to be a situation involving immediate safety of life or property, AND no other means of communication are available. And it really isn't that difficult IMO. The fellow who directly called the Police didn't have a need to do that, and in truth would have been better off to call 911, as they are the people with the resources needed to rescue people in that situation. There are some good reasons to use Amateur radio in emergencies. As an example, our local repeater system is a multi receiver polling system http://www.nittany-arc.net/newrepeater.html that takes the poll from several sites, selects the strongest one, and relays that to the main repeater. In this way, we can cover the whole county in a manner that 300 mw can pretty well work the entire area. This is all the more impressive when you look at a topo map of Centre County PA. Back to the reasons, if there is a deployment in the county, it can be a little difficult to establish comms from the regular systems, and in the northern parts of the county, cell phone coverage isn't easy to come by once you get away from the path that I-80 cuts through the hills. So in the nooks and crannies of the north part of the county, our repeater is a good choice, and if there are operations in both north and south, ham radio is a pretty good choice, and fits the criteria. I believe that in most cases, people aren't going to care a whole lot if there is a little gray area, but the "anything" description is just inaccurate and misleading. While this may be a small minority of emergency workers who fit the "I can do anything I want to do" description, they do need their errors pointed out when they make them. According to the fellow I had the discussion with at the meeting, there would be no rules anytime. -73 de Mike N3LI - |
#33
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#34
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![]() The moral of the story - good wishes have to be backed up by solid support. -- For me the moral of the story is that you need to match the training to the individual. Surely someone with the qualifications you listed could simply look throug a book for an hour or two and pass the test. Sending someone that highly qualified to the sort of experience you mentioned that is aimed at folks with no background at all is not apropriate IMHO. Jerry |
#35
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Phil Kane wrote in
: She started to take the three-session class offered by our radio club, using the ARRL's video tapes which in my view are insipid.. Halfway through the second tape she got up and left, declaiming "what the hell am I doing here" and strode out of the room. She never became interested again and I'm not about to press the issue. It seems like your xyl did the same thing as my wife, only in the opposite direction. She's every bit as intelligent as me, a quick study, and she has expressed some interest, but says "I could never do the things that you do", referring to the homebrewing and design I do. I keep telling her it isn't like that at all for a majority of Hams, but so far she has not gone for it. And likewise, I'm not going to press the issue! ;^) - 73 de Mike N3LI - |
#36
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![]() "Phil Kane" wrote in message ... On Wed, 27 Feb 2008 21:18:18 EST, "Dee Flint" wrote: I don't think my path will be very useful to use as a tool. My second husband dragged me to a class with the comment "Let's do this together". My wife has been married before, and all three of her husbands (I am the last and longest) were hams. She never was interested in ham radio until a while back when she expressed an interest in being able to "slide into the seat" when I did emergency hospital communications. As an electrical power and instrumentation engineer of some 40 years' experience, theory was no problem for her. She started to take the three-session class offered by our radio club, using the ARRL's video tapes which in my view are insipid.. Halfway through the second tape she got up and left, declaiming "what the hell am I doing here" and strode out of the room. She never became interested again and I'm not about to press the issue. The moral of the story - good wishes have to be backed up by solid support. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane I suspect that what happened here is that for a woman of her abilities, the material was presented too slowly and at the level of the lowest common denominator and she couldn't stand it (too boring). She would probably have done just fine with the Question & Answer book and it's brief explanations. Dee, N8UZE |
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