Once the official FCC changes are made, by whatever method, I wonder
how long it will take the unlicensed to become licensed...Now that
there's NO excuse remaining?

Just wondering.

Steve, K4YZ

In article ,
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) writes:

Once the official FCC changes are made, by whatever method, I wonder
how long it will take the unlicensed to become licensed...Now that
there's NO excuse remaining?

There's always an excuse, Steve.

Here are some predictions for ya:

The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant change
in the written exams.

The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant,
sustained increase in growth rate of the ARS. There may be a short term surge,
and lots of upgrades, but total numbers will not skyrocket.

The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant change
in the modes and technologies used by hams. There will not be a
technorevolution, nor big increases in experimentation or homebrewing. Just
more of the same of what has been going on.

---

Let's see what happens in the UK. RSGB and RA have been pushing to drop the
code test for a long time. Maybe they won't be disappointed.

Just wondering.

Don't hold yer breath. The usual bureaucratic delay will slow things down here
in the USA. And remember, those who get the licenses after the change will be
raw, inexperienced newcomers, who will need our help and guidance as they are
welcomed into the ARS.

73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:
In article ,
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) writes:


Once the official FCC changes are made, by whatever method, I wonder
how long it will take the unlicensed to become licensed...Now that
there's NO excuse remaining?


There's always an excuse, Steve.

Here are some predictions for ya:

The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant change
in the written exams.

Too bad. I'd like to see the exam restructured


The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant,
sustained increase in growth rate of the ARS. There may be a short term surge,
and lots of upgrades, but total numbers will not skyrocket.

Agreed.


The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant change
in the modes and technologies used by hams. There will not be a
technorevolution, nor big increases in experimentation or homebrewing. Just
more of the same of what has been going on.

Agreed. I'd like to hear just what sort of technorevolution some people
were expecting.

Do people who do not have the time to take the morse code test have the
time to invent new modes? Do they have time to invent digital voice
modes that take up bandwidth than ssb?


Let's see what happens in the UK. RSGB and RA have been pushing to drop the
code test for a long time. Maybe they won't be disappointed.


Just wondering.


Don't hold yer breath. The usual bureaucratic delay will slow things down here
in the USA. And remember, those who get the licenses after the change will be
raw, inexperienced newcomers, who will need our help and guidance as they are
welcomed into the ARS.

And there you have one of the more interesting dilemmas to the ARS.

Is a brand new Extra, who has never been on HF, even accept Elmering?
Or will they insist that the conventions that have been developed over
the years are not applicable to them.

This is not as far-fetched as it may seem. I tried to help out a new
Extra in a contest once. I knew he did not have any HF experience at
all, yet he wanted a bare minimum of help. After showing him where the
PTT was, and how to change bands, I started to explain the structure of
a contest QSO. He interrupted me after the first sentence with a "not to
be rude, but I'll take over now". I came back the next morning and saw
the results of his work. Six QSO's! He was woring at the rate of 1 QSO
per hour under *good* band conditions!

Even in my own experience, I know that I had my extra before I should
have. I went from General to Extra in a little over 6 months.

I would propose that there be at least a year wait before upgrading to
Extra. Ya just can't gain enough operating knowledge in less time.

=2D----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

"Mike" =3D=3D Mike Coslo writes:

[...]

Mike And there you have one of the more interesting dilemmas to the
Mike ARS.

Mike Is a brand new Extra, who has never been on HF, even accept
Mike Elmering? Or will they insist that the conventions that have
Mike been developed over the years are not applicable to them.

Some do, some don't. I know my limitations, and I accept assistance
and information from those who can help me.

Mike This is not as far-fetched as it may seem. I tried to help out a
Mike new Extra in a contest once. I knew he did not have any HF
Mike experience at all, yet he wanted a bare minimum of help. After
Mike showing him where the PTT was, and how to change bands, I
Mike started to explain the structure of a contest QSO. He
Mike interrupted me after the first sentence with a "not to be rude,
Mike but I'll take over now". I came back the next morning and saw
Mike the results of his work. Six QSO's! He was woring at the rate of
Mike 1 QSO per hour under *good* band conditions!

This is the opposite of my first HF contest experience -- just over a
year ago at Field Day. The group I was with was very gentle to new
contesters, to the point that they had written down precisely what we
were to say, what we needed to ask for, even to the point of reminding
us to wish other stations "good luck". This year's Field Day was the
first year that I ran a contest station unattended, and I was able to
provide some assistance to Technicians who wanted to work HF. It was
a good feeling, and I look forward to learning more if only to share
that knowledge with others.

Mike Even in my own experience, I know that I had my extra before I
Mike should have. I went from General to Extra in a little over 6
Mike months.

I went from Technician to Extra. I had my Technician ticket for two
years, and had only actually operated for six months before
upgrading.

Mike I would propose that there be at least a year wait before
Mike upgrading to Extra. Ya just can't gain enough operating
Mike knowledge in less time.

It's a good suggestion, but not something I'd like to see in FCC
regulations. Mileage may vary.

Jack.
=2D --=20
Jack Twilley
jmt at twilley dot org
http colon slash slash www dot twilley dot org slash tilde jmt slash
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=3DwX/f
=2D----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Jack Twilley wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1


"Mike" == Mike Coslo writes:

some snippage

Mike This is not as far-fetched as it may seem. I tried to help out a
Mike new Extra in a contest once. I knew he did not have any HF
Mike experience at all, yet he wanted a bare minimum of help. After
Mike showing him where the PTT was, and how to change bands, I
Mike started to explain the structure of a contest QSO. He
Mike interrupted me after the first sentence with a "not to be rude,
Mike but I'll take over now". I came back the next morning and saw
Mike the results of his work. Six QSO's! He was woring at the rate of
Mike 1 QSO per hour under *good* band conditions!

This is the opposite of my first HF contest experience -- just over a
year ago at Field Day. The group I was with was very gentle to new
contesters, to the point that they had written down precisely what we
were to say, what we needed to ask for, even to the point of reminding
us to wish other stations "good luck". This year's Field Day was the
first year that I ran a contest station unattended, and I was able to
provide some assistance to Technicians who wanted to work HF. It was
a good feeling, and I look forward to learning more if only to share
that knowledge with others.


Fortunately, everyone who Elmered me on HF ops was very kind.

If I were to make a guess on that guy's thoughts, he was probably
embarrassed at his inexperience. Not wanting to appear foolish, he just
acted brusque, and ended up looking foolish anyhoo.

- Mike KB3EIA -

In article , Mike Coslo writes:

N2EY wrote:
In article ,
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) writes:

Once the official FCC changes are made, by whatever method, I wonder
how long it will take the unlicensed to become licensed...Now that
there's NO excuse remaining?

There's always an excuse, Steve.

Here are some predictions for ya:

The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant
change
in the written exams.

Too bad. I'd like to see the exam restructured

The writtens WERE restructured back in 2000. The number of tests and the total
number of questions were reduced.

There were all sorts of suggestions in the comments submitted about how to
improve the writtens, but the FCC ignored all of them and reduced the written
testing as well as the code testing.

The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant,
sustained increase in growth rate of the ARS. There may be a short term
surge, and lots of upgrades, but total numbers will not skyrocket.

Agreed.

Watch the thread "ARS License Numbers"...

The dropping of the code test will not be accompanied by a significant
change
in the modes and technologies used by hams. There will not be a
technorevolution, nor big increases in experimentation or homebrewing. Just
more of the same of what has been going on.

Agreed. I'd like to hear just what sort of technorevolution some people

were expecting.

You shoulda been here a couple years ago when certain folks were telling us
what wonderful technologies we'd have it weren't for the code test. One of the
most vociferous is now Executive Director of NCI. He'd lecture us on how
primitive Morse Code and other modes hams use are, compared to what was
possible.

A year after the 2000 restructuring, he went from Tech Plus to Extra and went
on HF SSB, working DX with a manufactured transceiver. Last I heard he had over
70 countries. Surreal.


Do people who do not have the time to take the morse code test have the
time to invent new modes? Do they have time to invent digital voice
modes that take up bandwidth than ssb?

Ask 'em.

Let's see what happens in the UK. RSGB and RA have been pushing to drop
the code test for a long time. Maybe they won't be disappointed.

Just wondering.

Don't hold yer breath. The usual bureaucratic delay will slow things down
here in the USA. And remember, those who get the licenses after the change
will be
raw, inexperienced newcomers, who will need our help and guidance as they
are welcomed into the ARS.

And there you have one of the more interesting dilemmas to the ARS.

Is a brand new Extra, who has never been on HF, even accept
Elmering?

Some will, some won't. I'll do what I've always done - gladly help anybody who
asks.

Or will they insist that the conventions that have been developed over
the years are not applicable to them.

Some will, some won't. Those who won't will learn the hard way what works and
what doesn't.

This is not as far-fetched as it may seem. I tried to help out a new
Extra in a contest once. I knew he did not have any HF experience at
all, yet he wanted a bare minimum of help. After showing him where the
PTT was, and how to change bands, I started to explain the structure of
a contest QSO. He interrupted me after the first sentence with a "not to
be rude, but I'll take over now". I came back the next morning and saw
the results of his work. Six QSO's! He was woring at the rate of 1 QSO
per hour under *good* band conditions!

Been there, done that.

In fact I recall a certain FD a few years ago. Another rrap regular whom you
may know was working 20 CW, making about 40 QSOs/hr with a terrible antenna. He
was pressured into shutting down so that some folks could use 20 phone. Two
hours later, they had put maybe 4 contacts in the log. They complained that the
band was dead - so he sat down and proceeded to put a couple dozen in the log
on the "dead" band.

I recall another FD when somebody came over to the CW tent 3-4 hours into the
contest and wanted to know how I was doing. I said "just OK - only about 150 so
far". Guy cussed me out and called me a liar. So I showed him the log sheets.
bwaahaahaa

Even in my own experience, I know that I had my extra before I should
have. I went from General to Extra in a little over 6 months.

It ain't when ya get the license, it's what ya do with it.

I would propose that there be at least a year wait before upgrading to
Extra. Ya just can't gain enough operating knowledge in less time.

Not gonna happen.

73 de Jim, N2EY

N2EY wrote:
In article , Mike Coslo writes:

Agreed. I'd like to hear just what sort of technorevolution some people


were expecting.


You shoulda been here a couple years ago when certain folks were telling us
what wonderful technologies we'd have it weren't for the code test. One of the
most vociferous is now Executive Director of NCI. He'd lecture us on how
primitive Morse Code and other modes hams use are, compared to what was
possible.

Figures. I still wait, and probably will continue to wait.......


A year after the 2000 restructuring, he went from Tech Plus to Extra and went
on HF SSB, working DX with a manufactured transceiver. Last I heard he had over
70 countries. Surreal.


Do people who do not have the time to take the morse code test have the
time to invent new modes? Do they have time to invent digital voice
modes that take up bandwidth than ssb?


Ask 'em.

I already know the answer. I doubt they will admit to their laziness
tho! 8^)

some snippage

In fact I recall a certain FD a few years ago. Another rrap regular whom you
may know was working 20 CW, making about 40 QSOs/hr with a terrible antenna. He
was pressured into shutting down so that some folks could use 20 phone. Two
hours later, they had put maybe 4 contacts in the log. They complained that the
band was dead - so he sat down and proceeded to put a couple dozen in the log
on the "dead" band.

Yeah, I know many of the newbies and rusties complain about how the
GOTA station "isn't working" when I know it is. Lots easier to make
QSO's on thos 1KW stations.

It really is about 80 percent OP and 20 percent rig.


Som Extras are going to look mighty foolish.

I recall another FD when somebody came over to the CW tent 3-4 hours into the
contest and wanted to know how I was doing. I said "just OK - only about 150 so
far". Guy cussed me out and called me a liar. So I showed him the log sheets.
bwaahaahaa

All the testing in the world cannot produce a good operator.

Even in my own experience, I know that I had my extra before I should
have. I went from General to Extra in a little over 6 months.


It ain't when ya get the license, it's what ya do with it.

And it was a rapid, and sometimes humbling experience. Then again,
maybe that's okay.

I would propose that there be at least a year wait before upgrading to
Extra. Ya just can't gain enough operating knowledge in less time.


Not gonna happen.

Is there an emoticon for a Bronx cheer? 8^P

- Mike KB3EIA -

"N2EY" wrote in part ...

In fact I recall a certain FD a few years ago. Another rrap regular whom
you may know was working 20 CW, making about 40 QSOs/hr with a terrible
antenna. He was pressured into shutting down so that some folks could use 20
phone. Two hours later, they had put maybe 4 contacts in the log. They
complained that the band was dead - so he sat down and proceeded to put a
couple dozen in the log on the "dead" band.
__________________________________________________ ________________________

When I started working CW, one of the first things I did was get involved
with traffic nets. Slow ones at first, then the State net, then Regional.
One of the advantages of working high speed traffic nets is learning how to
copy fast under very poor conditions. Seems to pay off during Field Day. I
had the same experience this year at FD as you. Between the two of us, we
were logging an average of 75 or so contacts per hour, while the SSB boys
were doing about 10. Dead bands plus QRN, QSB and all those repeats, I
guess. :-))

Arnie -
KT4ST

"Mike Coslo" wrote in message
...

And there you have one of the more interesting
dilemmas to the ARS.

Is a brand new Extra, who has never been on HF,
even accept Elmering?
Or will they insist that the conventions that
have been developed over
the years are not applicable to them.

That depends on how many existing Hams on HF take
a crappy attitude towards the upgraded newcomers
on the bands. After seeing the poor attitudes
shown by several of the more frequent posters on
this news group over restructuring etc., I
wouldn't let them near a radio, with or with out a
code key. They are a perfect example of what Ham
Radio is not all about. On the other hand the only
good thing about them is many are old timers, who
if we wait long enough will be SK's, then we can
get on with things without the name calling etc.
The only choices they have is either go with the
flow, get out of the way, or get run over by the
changes. Rolling back the clock is not an option.


--
Leland C. Scott
KC8LDO

ARRL Member
NCI Member

Charter member of the
Lawrence Technological University
Wireless Society W8LTU

"Leland C. Scott" wrote in part ...

That depends on how many existing Hams on HF take a crappy attitude towards
the upgraded newcomers on the bands. After seeing the poor attitudes shown
by several of the more frequent posters on this news group over
restructuring etc., I wouldn't let them near a radio, with or with out a
code key.
__________________________________________________ ________________________

What's a "code key" -- Could that possibly be something like a straight key?
Or maybe it is a secret way of learning CW? Please enlighten us, Leland.

Arnie -
KT4ST
FISTS 2940 CC 337

member of "Know Code" International