From: K4YZ on Jun 6, 3:00 am

bb wrote:
Leo wrote:
On 5 Jun 2005 05:41:50 -0700, wrote:

Leo, what word would be more appropriate than "bull****" to
describe that claim?

Incorrect? As in "that claim is incorrect...."

I'm with you on that one, Leo.

But instead of "that claim is incorrect," we are treated to LIAR,
and/or Gay Man accusations from Jim's little puppet. Jim IS
Quitefine with it all.


Noooooooooo.......

Yaaasssssssssssssss................

You're treated to "liar" after you've made a claim and then failed
to back it up with at least SOME form of reasonable corroboration.

Tsk, tsk, tsk.

WHERE and WHEN were Stebie's CLAIMED "seven hostile actions"?


Saying "My opinion is..." is one thing. That's black and white.

Okay, now we understand...you no longer CLAIM "seven hostile
actions"...that is just YOUR OPINION. OK.


Saying "ARES is overblown and it's members wontt/can't respond" in
the face of almost weekly evidence to the contrary and then not
acknowledging it is just stupid.

"Wontt"? :-)

"Weekly evidence?" There are large-enough emergencies EVERY
WEEK in the USA that require amateur radio communications
assistance? [I don't think so...not even "almost"...]


Is it YOUR OPINION that you were an "Assistant" NCOIC at a
MARS station 24 years ago?

Do you acknowledge that the U.S. military runs MARS or is it
still YOUR OPINION that "MARS IS amateur radio?"

Temper fry.

wrote:
From: K4YZ on Jun 6, 3:00 am

bb wrote:
Leo wrote:
On 5 Jun 2005 05:41:50 -0700, wrote:

Leo, what word would be more appropriate than "bull****" to
describe that claim?

Incorrect? As in "that claim is incorrect...."

I'm with you on that one, Leo.

But instead of "that claim is incorrect," we are treated to LIAR,
and/or Gay Man accusations from Jim's little puppet. Jim IS
Quitefine with it all.


Noooooooooo.......

Yaaasssssssssssssss................

Nooooooooooooooooooooooo....................

You're treated to "liar" after you've made a claim and then failed
to back it up with at least SOME form of reasonable corroboration.

Tsk, tsk, tsk.

WHERE and WHEN were Stebie's CLAIMED "seven hostile actions"?

Some of them were on the front pages...two weren't.

When is when I was still on Active Duty.

The rest is "For Me To Know An You To Find Out"...

Saying "My opinion is..." is one thing. That's black and white.

Okay, now we understand...you no longer CLAIM "seven hostile
actions"...that is just YOUR OPINION.

Nope.

Saying "ARES is overblown and it's members wontt/can't respond" in
the face of almost weekly evidence to the contrary and then not
acknowledging it is just stupid.

"Wontt"?

Don't go there over the typos, Lennie...You're in that same pool,
Your Putziness, so don't pee in it...

"Weekly evidence?" There are large-enough emergencies EVERY
WEEK in the USA that require amateur radio communications
assistance? [I don't think so...not even "almost"...]

Yep.

Weekly.

Is it YOUR OPINION that you were an "Assistant" NCOIC at a
MARS station 24 years ago?

No.

It's a matter of RECORD that I was ANCOIC of the Okinawa
Islandwide MARS System in 1981. I was NCOIC of NNN0MOC/MOF during that
same time...

Just like I told you 6 weeks ago.

Do you acknowledge that the U.S. military runs MARS or is it
still YOUR OPINION that "MARS IS amateur radio?"

It's always been my postition that MARS is run by DoD.

It's ALSO been my position that my comments from the post you
continue to inaccurately paraphrase from were that the same spirit of
service that permeates Amateur Radio is part and parcel of the MARS
programs as they are almost completely fleshed out BY licensed,
civilian Amateur Radio operators.

No Amateur Radio = No MARS.

It really is THAT simple.

Steve, K4YZ

rom: on Jun 6, 3:00 am


wrote:
From: K4YZ on Jun 6, 3:00 am
bb wrote:
Leo wrote:
On 5 Jun 2005 05:41:50 -0700, wrote:

Leo, what word would be more appropriate than "bull****" to
describe that claim?

Incorrect? As in "that claim is incorrect...."

I'm with you on that one, Leo.

But instead of "that claim is incorrect," we are treated to LIAR,
and/or Gay Man accusations from Jim's little puppet. Jim IS
Quitefine with it all.


Nooooooooooooooooooooooo....................

Tsk, tsk, tsk. The Last Action Hero tries to turn every
subject thread to HIMSELF (and his multiple personalities).

You're treated to "liar" after you've made a claim and then failed
to back it up with at least SOME form of reasonable corroboration.

Tsk, tsk, tsk.

WHERE and WHEN were Stebie's CLAIMED "seven hostile actions"?

Some of them were on the front pages...two weren't.

Ahhhh, wowee! "Secret ops!" [all very hush-hush]

When is when I was still on Active Duty.

Which was when, 1974 to 1992?

The rest is "For Me To Know An You To Find Out"...

Ho ho ho. Mighty warrior making with grade-school taunts.

OKAY...let's got down the line in the Almanac and see what
those "front page" hostile actions we

1. The Vietanm War...was on-going in 1970 and ended 29 Apr 75
with the evacuation of all Americans from Siagon. And
then had a brief restart with the capture of the US
merchant ship Mayaguez. The USMC attacked a little island
in "response."

2. The American Embassy in Iran was taken over in 1979 and
several in a USAF-USA rescue force were killed before
they could get started on that on 24 Apr 79. [too early
for Stebie to have his "accident" and still serve]

3. A new USMC installation outside of Beirut, Lebanon was
hit by a suicide truck bomber, killing many marines on
23 Oct 83. [was that when Stebie had his "accident?"]

3 (a) A South Korean airliner was shot down by USSR fighters
on 1 Sep 83. No, not a USMC action; the U.S.Army
recorded the air-air and air-ground USSR comms and
that was played before the UN General Assembly.

4. The little island of Grenada was invaded by a combined
U.S. military force on 25 Oct 83. [maybe THAT was the
place that Stebie had his "accident?" too early]

4 (a) The cruise ship Achille Lauro was "shipjacked" by
terrorists in 1985 but that didn't involve USMC.

4 (b) An Iraqi missled killed 37 on the USN frigate USS
Stark on 17 May 87. All-USN, no USMC.

4 (c) The guided missle cruiser USS Vincennes shoots down
an Iranian airliner on 3 Jul 88, killing 290. Nope,
just USN "marksmanship" at work, no USMC.

5. U.S. forces invade Panama on 20 Dec 89, and eventually
capture Manuel Noriega (courtesy of the U.S. Army). Now
that MIGHT have been one of Stebie's hostile acts but
too soon for his "accident."

6. Operation Desert Shield begins on 2 Aug 90 and Operation
Desert Storm ends 27 Feb 91. Stebie doesn't brag about
being in either Kuwait or Iraq or Saudi Arabia. USAF
takes due credit for "Shield" and USA does most of "100
hour" ground war in "Storm" (see battle plan "73 Easting"
at West Point).

7. UN combined force enters Somalia on 9 Dec 92 but pull out
by 28 Feb 93. Stebie said he was NOT in Somalia.

7 (a) Branch Davidians catch fire on 28 Feb 93 but that is not
a USMC action.

8. Combined U.S. force enters Haiti on 32 Mar 95 for peace-
keeping purposes. [maybe Stebie tripped on something in
front of a VA office in TN as a civilian and had his
"accident?"]

Saying "My opinion is..." is one thing. That's black and white.

Okay, now we understand...you no longer CLAIM "seven hostile
actions"...that is just YOUR OPINION.

Nope.

Okay...it's just your BRAG. There's not enough for "seven" in
that list of "front page" news.

Were you shouldering your boresighted code key in your secret
ops you don't mention? Busy giving the "enemy" hell with your
morsemanship? Or weren't you simply doing REAR-AREA stuff and
polishing your own booties?



"Weekly evidence?" There are large-enough emergencies EVERY
WEEK in the USA that require amateur radio communications
assistance? [I don't think so...not even "almost"...]

Yep.

Weekly.

Tsk. You spelled "weakly" wrong twice.

Is it YOUR OPINION that you were an "Assistant" NCOIC at a
MARS station 24 years ago?

No.

It's a matter of RECORD that I was ANCOIC of the Okinawa
Islandwide MARS System in 1981. I was NCOIC of NNN0MOC/MOF during that
same time...

Tsk, tsk. All we readers get is a BROKEN RECORD in here,
unintelligible sound punctuated by cursing clicks.

Was that also a "secret ops" that you can't talk about?


Do you acknowledge that the U.S. military runs MARS or is it
still YOUR OPINION that "MARS IS amateur radio?"

It's always been my postition that MARS is run by DoD.

NOOOOOOO. You are ON RECORD - and in the archives of Google -
as having DENIED that. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

It's ALSO been my position that my comments from the post you
continue to inaccurately paraphrase from were that the same spirit of
service that permeates Amateur Radio is part and parcel of the MARS
programs as they are almost completely fleshed out BY licensed,
civilian Amateur Radio operators.

"Completely?" Tsk, tsk. No again. MARS was originally begun
as a very small-scale (and low budget) ARMY project back in
1925...more for publicity for the Army than any real radio
improvement (Motorola did more of that in 1940 than any bunch
of amateur volunteers). USA and USAF combined that activity
after WW2 and gave it the name of MILITARY AFFILIATE Radio
System. USN-USMC were last to join MARS in the sixties. If
MARS is "completely fleshed out" by civilian volunteers, why
are there USA and USAF MARS MILITARY Headquarter installations
on MILITARY posts?

No Amateur Radio = No MARS.

No Army experiment in 1925 and there never would have been a
MARS. Sorry, you lost. MARS is NOT a player in any of the
worldwide U.S. military tactical communications networks.

It really is THAT simple.

The TRUTH is out there, but you keep retreating to your private
internal FANTASY. Tsk, tsk.

wrote:
rom: on Jun 6, 3:00 am

It's a matter of RECORD that I was ANCOIC of the Okinawa
Islandwide MARS System in 1981. I was NCOIC of NNN0MOC/MOF during that
same time...

Tsk, tsk. All we readers get is a BROKEN RECORD in here,
unintelligible sound punctuated by cursing clicks.

Was that also a "secret ops" that you can't talk about?

Prove it. Show the RECORD.

Do you acknowledge that the U.S. military runs MARS or is it
still YOUR OPINION that "MARS IS amateur radio?"

It's always been my postition that MARS is run by DoD.

NOOOOOOO. You are ON RECORD - and in the archives of Google -
as having DENIED that. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

Yep. First he said, "Sorry Hans, MARS IS Amateur Radio."

Then there was a long period of defending that, followed by an even
longer period of backpedalling. Then he came up with a new plan, the
one below.

All archived.

It's ALSO been my position that my comments from the post you
continue to inaccurately paraphrase from were that the same spirit of
service that permeates Amateur Radio is part and parcel of the MARS
programs as they are almost completely fleshed out BY licensed,
civilian Amateur Radio operators.

No paraphrase. It is an EXACT quote. All archived

wrote:
rom: K4YZ on Jun 6, 3:00 am

Some of them were on the front pages...two weren't.

Ahhhh, wowee! "Secret ops!" [all very hush-hush]

I didn't say they were "secret ops", Lennie..You did.

I just said they weren't on the front pages.

Focus, Scumbag...Focus.

When is when I was still on Active Duty.

Which was when, 1974 to 1992?

The rest is "For Me To Know An You To Find Out"...

Ho ho ho. Mighty warrior making with grade-school taunts.

Nope...Just love rubbing your nose in it.

OKAY...let's got down the line in the Almanac and see what
those "front page" hostile actions we

1. The Vietanm War...was on-going in 1970 and ended 29 Apr 75
with the evacuation of all Americans from Siagon. And
then had a brief restart with the capture of the US
merchant ship Mayaguez. The USMC attacked a little island
in "response."

Nope.

Big snip of other actions.

I told you, Lennie...It's none of your business.

You want to claim I wasn't there and it's "just a brag"...Have
fun.

You'll be lying to everyone here AND yourself.

Also...get the details of the Mayaguez operation correct,
please...

The USMC provided ground troops on that mission...It was also
supported by the USAF and the US Navy.

The "USMC" attacked nothing...the United States did. The Armed
Forces, including the Marine Corps, ONLY move on the orders of the
CIVILIAN government that was put there by the electorate.

Saying "My opinion is..." is one thing. That's black and white.

Okay, now we understand...you no longer CLAIM "seven hostile
actions"...that is just YOUR OPINION.

Nope.

Okay...it's just your BRAG. There's not enough for "seven" in
that list of "front page" news.

No brag.

And you missed some events, Lennie.

Short on facts again.

Embarrassing, isn't it, Scumbag? All that knowledge at your
fingertips and still coming up short...?!?!

Were you shouldering your boresighted code key in your secret
ops you don't mention? Busy giving the "enemy" hell with your
morsemanship? Or weren't you simply doing REAR-AREA stuff and
polishing your own booties?

I didn't say they were "secret ops".

You did.

I said they weren't on the front page. Not every deployment
of the Armed Forces is a banner news item.

"Weekly evidence?" There are large-enough emergencies EVERY
WEEK in the USA that require amateur radio communications
assistance? [I don't think so...not even "almost"...]

Yep.

Weekly.

Tsk. You spelled "weakly" wrong twice.

Nope. Got it right. Nice try at diversion,
though...Cute..Timely...

Is it YOUR OPINION that you were an "Assistant" NCOIC at a
MARS station 24 years ago?

No.

It's a matter of RECORD that I was ANCOIC of the Okinawa
Islandwide MARS System in 1981. I was NCOIC of NNN0MOC/MOF during that
same time...

Tsk, tsk. All we readers get is a BROKEN RECORD in here,
unintelligible sound punctuated by cursing clicks.

Was that also a "secret ops" that you can't talk about?

I didn't say "secret ops", Lennie...YOU did.

I said it wasn't front page stuff.

Do you acknowledge that the U.S. military runs MARS or is it
still YOUR OPINION that "MARS IS amateur radio?"

It's always been my postition that MARS is run by DoD.

NOOOOOOO. You are ON RECORD - and in the archives of Google -
as having DENIED that. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

You are lying, Lennie. Again.

It's ALSO been my position that my comments from the post you
continue to inaccurately paraphrase from were that the same spirit of
service that permeates Amateur Radio is part and parcel of the MARS
programs as they are almost completely fleshed out BY licensed,
civilian Amateur Radio operators.

"Completely?" Tsk, tsk. No again. MARS was originally begun
as a very small-scale (and low budget) ARMY project back in
1925...more for publicity for the Army than any real radio
improvement (Motorola did more of that in 1940 than any bunch
of amateur volunteers). USA and USAF combined that activity
after WW2 and gave it the name of MILITARY AFFILIATE Radio
System. USN-USMC were last to join MARS in the sixties.

"Motorola" as a company didn't exist until 1947, Lennie, so how
did THAT happen?

Until 1947 "Motorola" was a "model" of car radio.

(Damn...bet THAT stings.....)

If MARS is "completely fleshed out" by civilian volunteers, why
are there USA and USAF MARS MILITARY Headquarter installations
on MILITARY posts?

Lennie, if you're going to misquote me, it would behoove you to NOT
try and misquote me while simultaneously cut-and-pasting my exact words
from the previous post.

No Amateur Radio = No MARS.

No Army experiment in 1925 and there never would have been a
MARS. Sorry, you lost. MARS is NOT a player in any of the
worldwide U.S. military tactical communications networks.

It really is THAT simple.

The TRUTH is out there, but you keep retreating to your private
internal FANTASY. Tsk, tsk.

The "internal fantasy" here, is yours. That being that you know
anything truly meaningful about Amateur Radio or any of it's associated
programs.

Steve, K4YZ

From: "bb" on Tues 7 Jun 2005 18:48


wrote:
rom: on Jun 6, 3:00 am

It's a matter of RECORD that I was ANCOIC of the Okinawa
Islandwide MARS System in 1981. I was NCOIC of NNN0MOC/MOF during that
same time...

Tsk, tsk. All we readers get is a BROKEN RECORD in here,
unintelligible sound punctuated by cursing clicks.

Was that also a "secret ops" that you can't talk about?

Prove it. Show the RECORD.

I can't prove it, haven't seen it. :-)


Do you acknowledge that the U.S. military runs MARS or is it
still YOUR OPINION that "MARS IS amateur radio?"

It's always been my postition that MARS is run by DoD.

NOOOOOOO. You are ON RECORD - and in the archives of Google -

as having DENIED that. Tsk, tsk, tsk.

Yep. First he said, "Sorry Hans, MARS IS Amateur Radio."

Then there was a long period of defending that, followed by an even
longer period of backpedalling. Then he came up with a new plan, the
one below.

All archived.

All "LIES," Brian. Stebie never wrote any exact words and
denies it all. Someone of the great Anti-Stebie Conspiracy
got into Google and falsified the archives!

It's ALSO been my position that my comments from the post you
continue to inaccurately paraphrase from were that the same spirit of
service that permeates Amateur Radio is part and parcel of the MARS
programs as they are almost completely fleshed out BY licensed,
civilian Amateur Radio operators.

No paraphrase. It is an EXACT quote. All archived

It's part of the Big Conspiracy against Stebie.

K4YZ wrote:

The "internal fantasy" here, is yours. That being that you know
anything truly meaningful about Amateur Radio or any of it's associated
programs.

Steve, K4YZ

Steve, there sure is lots of protesting and denial in your post, and
lots of claims of "not headline news" hostile actions. Len would be
pleased. Very pleased.

Can you give us some examples of what you consider hostile actions?

Probably not. OK, I'll give some.

Scenario 7: You are heading to the "actionable area" to train USA
personnel at a RADAR site. The hills are painted green and have very
large numbers on them. You reach a checkpoint manned my Host Nation
Army. They point guns in your face and tell you "No." They apparently
have no other vocabularly.

Is that a hostile action?

Scenario 6: Same general area. You are deployed to an -exercise-
location. A round of artillery explodes about 200 meters away from
your tent.

Is that a hostile action?

Scenario 5: You are involved in on a meals on wheels operation. As
you travel through a primary city, you see a vehicle paralleling your
convoy, and it has it's 50 cal pointing directly at you.

Is that a hostile action?

Scenario 4: Same location. While "in-garrison" you receive fire from
a nearby building which overlooks the compound. The bullets go wide.

Is that a hostile action?

Scenario 3: Same location. It is New Year's Eve, Dec 31, 1992 and you
see rockets going back and forth outside your compound. Thirty cal
fire kicks up sand in front of you.

Is that a hostile action?

Scenario 2: Same location. Later in January, while moving toward the
just opened chow hall, it is hit by a single 30mm round.

Is that a hostile action?

And Secnario 1: Okinawa. The "A" NCOIC of a MARS shop gets short
sheeted by his troops because he doesn't know dink about comms.

Is that a hostile action?

bb wrote:
K4YZ wrote:

The "internal fantasy" here, is yours. That being that you know
anything truly meaningful about Amateur Radio or any of it's associated
programs.

Steve, K4YZ

Steve, there sure is lots of protesting and denial in your post, and
lots of claims of "not headline news" hostile actions. Len would be
pleased. Very pleased.

What protesting?

Can you give us some examples of what you consider hostile actions?

Engaged in direct fire with a hostile opponent. Exchanging
gunfire.

REAL gunfire...no BFA's.

Probably not. OK, I'll give some.

Cute. None of them correct.

Is that a hostile action?

I am sure that you wouldn't know "hostile action" if it greeted you
in the parking lot and poked you in the nose, Brian...

Steve, K4YZ

K4YZ wrote:
bb wrote:
K4YZ wrote:

The "internal fantasy" here, is yours. That being that you know
anything truly meaningful about Amateur Radio or any of it's associated
programs.

Steve, K4YZ

Steve, there sure is lots of protesting and denial in your post, and
lots of claims of "not headline news" hostile actions. Len would be
pleased. Very pleased.

What protesting?

Can you give us some examples of what you consider hostile actions?

Engaged in direct fire with a hostile opponent. Exchanging
gunfire.

REAL gunfire...no BFA's.

Probably not. OK, I'll give some.

Cute. None of them correct.

Is that a hostile action?

I am sure that you wouldn't know "hostile action" if it greeted you
in the parking lot and poked you in the nose, Brian...

Steve, K4YZ

I'm sure you wouldn't know either. Got any proof?

bb wrote:
K4YZ wrote:
bb wrote:
K4YZ wrote:

The "internal fantasy" here, is yours. That being that you know
anything truly meaningful about Amateur Radio or any of it's associated
programs.

Steve, K4YZ

Steve, there sure is lots of protesting and denial in your post, and
lots of claims of "not headline news" hostile actions. Len would be
pleased. Very pleased.

What protesting?

Can you give us some examples of what you consider hostile actions?

Engaged in direct fire with a hostile opponent. Exchanging
gunfire.

REAL gunfire...no BFA's.

Probably not. OK, I'll give some.

Cute. None of them correct.

Is that a hostile action?

I am sure that you wouldn't know "hostile action" if it greeted you
in the parking lot and poked you in the nose, Brian...

Steve, K4YZ

I'm sure you wouldn't know either.

Then you'd be wrong. (As if THAT were new...)

Got any proof?

Shall I demonstrate, or are you willing to accept that what would
transpire would cause you pain and suffering (along with some moderate
bleeding, easily controlled with ice and direct pressure?)

Steve, K4YZ