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#151
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![]() That makes it a real PITA to people who are good at book learnin' and not so hot at motor skills. Those are the same people who get As in Chemistry but Ds in Chem Lab..... Most colleges make Chem class 3 credits but Chem Lab 1 credit, and some others just lump the two together for 4 credits. and the grades are usually weighed so labs rate for about 25% of the final grade. Similar things happen with Calculus class, I learned how to solve exam problems but never did figure out how to actually USE calculus to solve a real world problem. In undergraduate college, if it doesn't show on the tests, there's no point in learning it (unless you find something interesting on its own). |
#152
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Mike Coslo wrote:
wrote: . . . Is it possible that the woman engineers I don't see out here are operating in academia instead?? Would not surprise me a bit if that's the case. I work with 5 or so regularly. I think you are probably correct regarding their increased presence in academia, compared to industry. My thoughts on why that is so are based on two ideas. First is that the academic world is sensitive to gender issues, due to groups that bust on them if they are not. The Harvard guy . . . . Yee-haw! SPANK! This leads to the second reason. That is that until there are a lot more women graduating in the engineering fields, the academic world will scap them up pretty quickly. No particular comment here, I've been completely out of touch with the innards of academia for years. Some have noted that women tend to think differently than men, and may not want to go into the engineering fields as a result of that difference. (note that this is as a trend- not as the circumstances regarding any one woman) I am not sure if the differences are instinctual, or culture based. Time will tell. And it will probably be quite a long time. Certainly women think differently than men and it's good thing they do in several respects. As far as the timing of the emergence of large numbers of woman engineers goes. Hell, I know scads of women contemporaries of mine whose parents never gave them a chance to go into higher education "because the woman's place is in the home barefoot, pregnant and in the kitchen". Never mind support their daughters desires to become engineers. Society has come a long way since those days but it's gonna take a few more generations before this thinking actually prevails. Of course she had "problems" with this male chauvinist pig. Finally got down to me suggesting that instead of differentiating by the man/woman thing we differtiate by using "X-Chromosone people" and "Y-Chromosone people" instead. Only got me about ten seconds of peace before she recovered and got all over me again. Yoiks! Yeah yoicks . . she drove me batty, you would not believe it. 15 years later she glomed two degrees before she turned 21, has four kids, a big home in a cushy neighborhood and votes Republican . . . I recently told her 13-year-old son about his Mom riding with Warlocks when she was 14. I dunno how I survived but I have so now it's payback time for Pop-pop. Her two sisters weren't cakewalks either. In fairness to the particular engineer, she is not particularly obnoxious. Mostly just wants to get her work done. - Mike KB3EIA - w3rv |
#153
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![]() wrote in message oups.com... Dee Flint wrote: wrote in message . . . encounters with woman engineers. Is it possible that the woman engineers I don't see out here are operating in academia instead?? Would not surprise me a bit if that's the case. I work out in the trenches of the automotive industry Got it, misimpression on my part, I think you've mentioned "your students" in the past and I assumed the rest. Ham radio students. Dee D. Flint, N8UZE |
#155
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![]() wrote: Mike Coslo wrote: wrote: Certainly women think differently than men and it's good thing they do in several respects. As far as the timing of the emergence of large numbers of woman engineers goes. Hell, I know scads of women contemporaries of mine whose parents never gave them a chance to go into higher education "because the woman's place is in the home barefoot, pregnant and in the kitchen". Never mind support their daughters desires to become engineers. Society has come a long way since those days but it's gonna take a few more generations before this thinking actually prevails. Arrrgh! Change "prevails" to "dies out"! |
#156
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#157
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John Smith wrote:
... the young person of today has a much great education than his/her counterpart of even twenty years ago... Yeah, some of 'em can't even make change without an electronic cash register. Many of them read below the high school level. They have little in the way of cultural literacy. Most are woefully inadequate in geography. They're all sharp. Dave K8MN |
#158
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Cmd Buzz Corey wrote:
Top Posting John Smith wrote: You know, Buzz, I wonder why he top posts when everyone else here in rrap does the interactive thing. Kelly: Yep. I think you are unaware that some of us out here have our licenses, got our radios fired up, tune the bands--and it is nothing but the same old, same old... Obviously only tunes the 'phone subbands... We do see all the rag chews, boring rants, same operators, same gripes, same rants, same little groups, same ideas, same conversations as yesterday--day, after day, after day... So what do you want them to talk about? I thought hams could converse about whatever pleases them. I don't see anything in the FCC regulations that says hams can only talk about this and can't talk about that. Do you? Actually there are a few limitations. Hams are not allowed to use amateur radio to discuss: - Anything of "pecuniary interest", meaning something that would result in a monetary profit for those in the discussion. (K1MAN got into hot water with that recently - he kept mentioning his website and stuff that could be bought there.) - Anything that could aid in the violation of local, state, or federal laws. (Discussing ways to jumper your electric meter in order to reduce your bill, for example, is prohibited.) - Anything that meets FCC's legal definition of obscenity. I don't recall any other subjects that hams aren't allowed to discuss on the ham bands. I am sure a lot of 'em are sitting there waiting for us poor ignorant ops to "get with it" and "come to the realization" of just how vital and interesting this all is and SHOULD BE to us.. If you aren't interested no one is holding a gun to your head to make you listen. Have enough sense to either change to another frequency/band or turn the damn radio off and find something else to do. I think you're missing an important point, Buzz. John is complaining about the content of what he hears on the ham bands (actually the 'phone subbands) but doesn't tell us what *he* would find interesting to talk about. Nor does he seem to be setting an example. Well I am one which does not and cannot appreciate it... if the fault lies with me and my interests and views--so be it... Thank goodness not everyone has to share your views or interests. If I am wrong and all these young guys just can't wait to get a license and startup a QSO so they hear these old guys fart and rant--well, that is just a short coming of mine--and, those young dynamic guys who are running the world right now and providing new ideas, designs and methods are probably on the way here right now to find the old farts.... I'll just sit here and wait for 'em, I need a change... maybe I can chat with one or two of 'em--if they can quit their hero worship of you guys long enough... grin John Sure sounds like ham radio isn't for you. Maybe you should go back to cb and the 'freeband'. Sounds like ageism to me. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
#159
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Dave Heil wrote:
wrote: Please continue to praise the military morse ops, , especially those of the USN. The USN is NOT a branch of the military you were in. Indeed, you weren't in ANY branch of the military. You "served in other ways." The Amateur Radio Service is not something in which you are a participant. Perhaps you served in other ways. game, set, match! - Mike KB3EIA - |
#160
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wrote:
Phil Kane wrote: On 15 Jun 2005 17:01:18 -0700, wrote: In all my 43 years in engineering I've met a grand total of four woman engineers, two MEs, one EE and a Chem E. In my 50 years in engineering I've =dated= more women engineers than you seem to have met, was engaged to one (nuclear engineer) and married another (EE). In my wife's office alone there are more than 4 =PEs= on her floor, including the chief of the structural engineering section (imagine that, a lady tower engineer). Had my wife gone through the paperwork as she talked about twenty years ago she, too, would have been a PE. Our contesting club alone has three female members, an old girlfriend is a ham and I met W3CUL. Out of Lord only knows how many engineers and hams I've met over the years. In our club, the largest radio club in the state if not in the Pacific Northwest, about 1/3 of the hams are women, and of them, about half are active on the air in some fashion or other. This topic is getting interesting, I'd like to take it a bit further. I'm at a complete loss to understand why there's such an obvious disparity in the numbers of woman hams & engineers in this part of the country vs. in your part of the country. Me too! With respect to the socioeconomicpolitical mindsets Oregon is well known for marching to it's own occasionally quirky liberal drummer while PA is a typical old-form mid-Atlantic centrist sort of place. I 'spose there are some of the usual left coast / right coast differences which sort of favor left coast women and might explain part of it. But good grief, we're not talking Albania and Sweden here. But there are other differences. Population density in BosWash is much higher than in the Pacific Northwest. Things like telephones and TV were here sooner, particularly in terms of "most people have them". And most of this area has been "settled" by non-Native Americans for 300+ years. I've mulled the matter off and on for a few hours and it occurs to me that maybe, just maybe our exposures to women engineers in particular have been quite different. As in where you've churned your coin vs. where I've gotten mine over the years. I've only spent a total of ten years working for large entities, six as a Navy employee back when woman engineers simply didn't exist for all practical purposes, then much later I did four with the DuPont central engineering center in the mid-1980s. Three of the four woman engineers I've met and cited were DuPont employees, the fourth was a short-time part timer I ran into on a specific small-biz project whose real job was with some large firm or another. Another factor is which engineering disciplines and sub-disciplines you encounter. There may be a lot more female ChemEs than MechEs. Etc. My class of 33 at Penn (1976, Moore School of Electrical Engineering) graduated 3 women - all specializing in computers. I don't think Towne School graduated any female engineers that year. Of course that's ancient history compared to today's ratios, but it shows a starting point almost 30 years ago. Except for the six I did with the Navy, a gig I loved and was enormous fun I've spent most of the rest of my career in smokestack small-medium size busineses. I have allergic reactions to huge employers for a number of reasons and generally avoid them. I despise corporate beige with a purple passion If I have it right you spent most of your career with the FCC, another huge entity. Is it possible that women in engineering tend to gravitate in large numbers to major entities where fair employment practices are actually practiced and you've gotten involved with more of them than I've ever managed to meet? Perhaps not so much "gravitate" as in "are forced by circumstances"? All of which is and has been changing. But it takes a long time for such trends to make their way through the workforce. -- 73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon w3rv Out here in the smokestacks of Delaware County PA Ditto if you can say Radnor has smokestacks. 73 de Jim, N2EY |
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