Hello,
How do the old tube type receivers such as the
Hammarlund ,Hallicrafter etc compare to the modern solid state
receivers in performance?
I am curious about the longevity of the tube radios on the market.
Thank you,
Mike McManus

The higher end boat anchors (HRO50/60, R390A, Collins, Drake, et al)
compare quite favorably especially on noise floor. Jay Rusgrove, has
compiled (and done his own tests) on quite a few BA receivers (Minimum
Discernible Signal, Dynamic Range). You can see the test results he
http://www.w1vd.com/BAreceivertest.html and he http://www.w1vd.com/BAdynamicrange.pdf

For comparison here are lists of more modern receiver test results:

http://www.sherweng.com/table.html





On Mar 7, 8:46*am, "Mike M." wrote:
Hello,
* How do the old tube type receivers such as the
Hammarlund ,Hallicrafter etc compare to the modern solid state
receivers in performance?
* *I am curious about the longevity of the tube radios on the market.
Thank you,
Mike McManus

Mike M. wrote:
Hello,
How do the old tube type receivers such as the
Hammarlund ,Hallicrafter etc compare to the modern solid state
receivers in performance?
I am curious about the longevity of the tube radios on the market.

Two separate issues.

All of the old radios are starting to show their age. Capacaitors are failing.
tubes are failing (some of the cheaper ones were not as "airtight" as people
thought), and so on. Once they are properly maintained, with replacement
capacitors, new tubes if needed, etc, they can perform as well as they
did the way they were made.

However the chance of finding an old (1930-1940's) rig that has sat on
the shelf for 30 years, turning it on, and not seeking smoke and actually
hearing anything except hum is pretty small.

There are proper ways to bring them back to life, and often they work
with few parts needing to be replaced.

As for performance, it depends upon the radio. On the lower frequencies
(below 15mHz) they should do quite well, some of the 1930's vintage rigs
tuned up to 30 or 40mHz, but were quite "deaf" there.

Since they do not have sythesizers, they are generally quiet, with low internal
noise. What they lack is filtering, although some were made with Collins
mechaincal filters (or similar ones) which are as good as or better than
their modern equivalent.

You also should, IMHO look at some of the lesser rigs too. People sat around
for hours listening to them, the way they spend time watching their plasma
TVs these days before hitting pause and switching to their email. :-)

They won't hold up well on a crowded band, but if you can find a clear signal
with little close by stations, they can be a pleasant listen.

Geoff.


--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson, Jerusalem, Israel N3OWJ/4X1GM
New word I coined 12/13/09, "Sub-Wikipedia" adj, describing knowledge or
understanding, as in he has a sub-wikipedia understanding of the situation.
i.e possessing less facts or information than can be found in the Wikipedia.

One of the best of the "lesser rigs" is the Hammarlund HQ120/129/140
series. Very well built, easy to work on/recap, excellent performance.
You can find nice ones for $150 or so. Also the older Super Pros
including the mil. versions (SP200/400, BC779, etc.).

The cheaper Hallicrafters, generally speaking, suffered from cheap
components & build quality.


You also should, IMHO look at some of the lesser rigs too. People sat around
for hours listening to them, the way they spend time watching their plasma
TVs these days before hitting pause and switching to their email. :-)

They won't hold up well on a crowded band, but if you can find a clear signal
with little close by stations, they can be a pleasant listen.

Geoff.

On 3/7/10 07:46 , Mike M. wrote:
Hello,
How do the old tube type receivers such as the
Hammarlund ,Hallicrafter etc compare to the modern solid state
receivers in performance?


Depends on the radio. There is no hard and fast rule about hollow
state vs solid state. Each operator may have his or her preferences
and prejudices, but it comes down to what you like and how well the
circuitry was designed.

R-390/R392 still stands in legend as the lowest noise floor of
hollow state.

While the higher end Ten-Tecs and W-J stand toe to toe with it in
solid state.

Tube receivers are prized for their audio. Warm, smooth, and
pleasing to the ear. And this can be true.

Then again, solid state audio can be more precise, almost
clinical, and equally pleasing to the ear. It depends on the
circuitry, and what attention to detail is paid.

And it depends on application. A noisier receiver with a good
antenna can easily outperform a better receiver with a mediocre
antenna.

Now, there have been some very good development in receivers
since the end of the tube era. No longer do we have to toy with
phasing on a crystal filter for reasonable selectivity. We can now
select from a range of filters, shift the passband, and engage
synchronous detection to clean up a buried signal.

Similarly, performance over a wider range of frequencies with
excellent consistency is possible with modern receivers than with
vintage boatanchors. In many cases. But certainly not all.

Modern receivers can be far more power efficient, present a
smaller desktop footprint.

But the truth is, that if you select your receiver wisely, and
you apply an antenna that will bring the most out of your receiver,
you can use, effectively, any receiver you enjoy, and achieve the
results you're looking for. Older rigs will take more fiddling, and
there will be thermal drift to deal with. Newer rigs will come up
quickly, stay put sooner, and will require less fiddling to do the
same job.


I am curious about the longevity of the tube radios on the market.
Thank you,
Mike McManus


That's going to depend on the availablity of tubes, mostly. Some
are getting difficult to come by. Some may still be substituted with
more available, or better, tubes. But nearly all tubes are out of
print for RF work. You're going to have to scrounge for NOS. And
sometimes pay obscene prices from scalpers. (Many of whom frequent
these groups.) And some specific components like tuning capacitors
and IF cans are getting difficult to find, as well.

That's not to say that tube rigs are any worse than solid state
in this regard. The most recent generation of AOR rigs is now based
on out of print chips for which there are no substitutes. And
displays for Drake receivers have been drying up for a number of
models. Similarly, many rigs are finding themselves to be of limited
serviceability due to discountinued parts of all types.

Find an SP-325. Ten-Tec doesn't even acknowledge that they built
it. While Fair Radio sells parts and whole subchassis for R-390 and
R-392.

That said, it is generally easier to modify a point to point
wired tube rig for a different tube, or other component, than it is
to modify a PCB based solidstate rig for a newer IC. But, too,
that's not always the case.

So, again, it depends on the radio. And it depends on your
commitment to the receiver of your choice. You'll can always build a
receiving station to fit your needs and the rig of your choice. And
at the same time, you can always find SOMETHING to keep your
favorite rig working, if you ensure you have the technical
understanding, and the tenacity to keep it working.

Once you understand the limitations and the advantages of each,
the whole tube vs solid state thing becomes largely a non issue.

My Drakes and Ten-Tecs sit next to my Hallicrafters and
Hammarlunds. Everyone of them gets a regular workout.

Watching an old 1937 Mr.Autery movie on the Western channel.
Public Cowboy, No. 1
Gene Autry, Smiley Burnette, Ann Rutherford.
Modern day cattle rustlers use a shortwave radio, airplanes and
refrigerator trucks to expedite their illegal schemes.

Modern day cattle rustling is still happening nowadays.
cuhulin

If you get to handling old tubes, (vacuum tubes) removing or replacing
them, be very carefull, it is all too easy to wipe the printing off of
the outside of those old tubes.
cuhulin

wrote:

Watching an old 1937 Mr.Autery movie on the Western channel.
Public Cowboy, No. 1
Gene Autry, Smiley Burnette, Ann Rutherford.
Modern day cattle rustlers use a shortwave radio, airplanes and
refrigerator trucks to expedite their illegal schemes.

Modern day cattle rustling is still happening nowadays.

That's an awesome sentence!

wrote:
Watching an old 1937 Mr.Autery movie on the Western channel.
Public Cowboy, No. 1
Gene Autry, Smiley Burnette, Ann Rutherford.
Modern day cattle rustlers use a shortwave radio, airplanes and
refrigerator trucks to expedite their illegal schemes.

Modern day cattle rustling is still happening nowadays.
cuhulin


Those movies were pretty much all made right here in Canyon Country or
Newhall.

In article 305c471c-835e-4a0c-8d05-671be3e7ae07
@q16g2000yqq.googlegroups.com, says...
Hello,
How do the old tube type receivers such as the
Hammarlund ,Hallicrafter etc compare to the modern solid state
receivers in performance?
I am curious about the longevity of the tube radios on the market.
Thank you,
Mike McManus


Audio wise, many of the old radios are much better, but in most other
ways, especially stability, the radios from the last 30 years are
totally superior. Some of them have almost zero drift, like a few hertz
over hours.

I had an Hammarlund HQ-180 and it was a great radio. I had it for about
a year, and sold it at a nice profit. It was totally reliable for the
time I had it, and since then, the new owner reports in 10 years, it's
needed a couple tubes, that's it. Cost? about 10 bucks.

I've had an cheapie Hammarlund HQ-100 for about 6 years, with all kinds
of mods. It's really good on AM, and SSB is very good, since it has an
added product detector, but you can't just walk away and let it sit, as
it drifts around to the point it's annoying to listen to for long
periods without constant tweaking of the tuning knob. All I've had to do
to it since I bought it was to change two tubes that were getting weak,

I got it for $58 on Ebay, and I consider it one of the best bargains
I've ever had, only beaten by the vacuum desoldering station I got a
couple years ago for $24 shipped.

I've had a couple others, but they needed things from caps to tubes, to
a transformer (Worked for almost a month before it cooked itself), and
one needed almost everything in it replaced. A friend bought it for the
chassis, it was in great shape, and he transplanted the guts from his
radio into it, and then slowly fixed the guts from the original radio.
--

BDK..
Leader of the nonexistent paid shills.
Non Jew Jew Club founding member.
Former number one Kook Magnet, title passed to Iarnrod.