Hi guys

I have a Icom R75 and Lowe HF-150 I want to run off a Astron PSU model
SL-11a. It's 13.84V and 7Amps. Now, I have some questions please about how
to protect my radios from any mishaps from the PSU or otherwise.

Now the specs for the R75 says it's current drain at 13.80v + or - 15% is :
Standy 0.9 Amps
Max. Audio 1.1 Amps

I bought a 2 conductor DC accessory cable that has a fuse holder on it. I
will use that to connect the PSU to the radio.
It it means anything it is 22 AWG RS part # 270-025

1] Now, what size fuse should I put in the fuse holder to make sure the
radio is totally protected from the PSU?

2] Am I protecting the radio from too much volts or amps or both? I figured
Amps.

3] I have some 250V 1.6 Amp fast acting fuses. The are 5 x 20mm GMA type
fuses. Radio Shack part number 270-1051. Are these OK? Is the main thing the
Amp rating and not the volt rating?

4] The Icom Radio comes with
3 Amp FGB fuses internally and for the DC cable. Now if the radio draws say
no more then 1.1 Amps, why are they using a 3 amp fuse? Why not 1.5A or even
2A? Why 3A?

5] So is 1.6A too low, too high, or just good? Should I go even lower to be
sure?

6] Now, the fuse in the Astron PSU itself.
Is that to protect from volt surges or amps surges?

7] Do you think I'm going to extreme measures to protect my receivers since
the Astron PSU is supposed to be that good? I want total peace of mind
knowing I did all I could to protect them.

8] My Lowe HF-150 will use 13.80v and the same PSU also. According to the
manual it can use between 10-15V and it draws approx 300mA but I think it's
more in the 500mA range to work properly.

9] Do you think I need a different fuse size in the holder to protect the
150 or will what I use to protect the R75 be sufficient for the 150 also?

10] What is the difference between "GMA" and "FGB" type fuses? Is it better
to use the longer ones, the mini ones or it doesn't matter?

I really appreciate the help. The guys at Radio Shack did their best to help
me but they weren't sure.
Thank you
Lucky

Lucky wrote:
I have a Icom R75 and Lowe HF-150 I want to run off a Astron PSU model
SL-11a. It's 13.84V and 7Amps. Now, I have some questions please about how
to protect my radios from any mishaps from the PSU or otherwise.

Now the specs for the R75 says it's current drain at 13.80v + or - 15% is :
Standy 0.9 Amps
Max. Audio 1.1 Amps

I bought a 2 conductor DC accessory cable that has a fuse holder on it. I
will use that to connect the PSU to the radio.
It it means anything it is 22 AWG RS part # 270-025

1] Now, what size fuse should I put in the fuse holder to make sure the
radio is totally protected from the PSU?

About 2 amps. (as a rule of thumb I would fuse a circuit at
approximately twice the maximum expected current under normal
conditions) Most likely failures will cause the circuit to draw a LOT
more than the rated 1.1 amps, more than enough to blow a 2 or 3-amp fuse.

2] Am I protecting the radio from too much volts or amps or both? I figured
Amps.

The fuse protects against excessive current -- too many amps.

To be honest you're not as much protecting the radio as you're
protecting the power supply & your house. If the radio starts drawing
much more than 1.1 amps, it already has a serious problem. However,
without the fuse it might cause the power supply to overheat, or (more
likely) cause the wiring to overheat, or whatever part in the radio is
defective might start smoking or even burning.

That said, you're also protecting the radio against reverse polarity.
(getting the power supply connected backwards) The radio probably
contains a polarity protection diode. If you connect the power supply
backwards, this diode limits the voltage that can appear across the
radio to less than 1 volt - but it does so by causing the radio to draw
very high currents. (at least 10 amps, probably more) The idea is that
the fuse will blow, disconnecting the voltage, before the protection
diode can get hot enough to burn out.

According to the Astron website, the SL-11A power supply has builtin
protection against excessive voltage. Actually, it's pretty similar to
the polarity protection in the radio -- if the output voltage from the
supply gets too high, a diode within the supply draws very high
currents, causing a fuse inside the supply to burn out before the
attached equipment (your radios) can be damaged.

3] I have some 250V 1.6 Amp fast acting fuses. The are 5 x 20mm GMA type
fuses. Radio Shack part number 270-1051. Are these OK? Is the main thing the
Amp rating and not the volt rating?

They're OK. They *may* be more likely to burn out (if the radio for
some reason draws a bit more current then specified) but the only
consequence is you'll have to buy more fuses. It won't damage the radios.

The voltage rating must be high enough to ensure the power doesn't arc
across the fuse if the fuse blows. A 250-volt fuse is more than
adequate for your 13.8 volt circuit. (it is possible to get 32-volt
fuses that certainly would NOT be adequate in a 250-volt circuit!)

4] The Icom Radio comes with
3 Amp FGB fuses internally and for the DC cable. Now if the radio draws say
no more then 1.1 Amps, why are they using a 3 amp fuse? Why not 1.5A or even
2A? Why 3A?

5] So is 1.6A too low, too high, or just good? Should I go even lower to be
sure?

Probably a bit low but if it were my equipment, I'd try it.

I wouldn't go any lower, you'd probably have nuisance failures.


6] Now, the fuse in the Astron PSU itself.
Is that to protect from volt surges or amps surges?

Both. (see my answer to #2) (some power supplies don't have
overvoltage protection, in which case the PSU fuse only protects against
current - amps - surges.)

7] Do you think I'm going to extreme measures to protect my receivers since
the Astron PSU is supposed to be that good? I want total peace of mind
knowing I did all I could to protect them.

I don't think fusing the power cords to the radios is paranoia.

8] My Lowe HF-150 will use 13.80v and the same PSU also. According to the
manual it can use between 10-15V and it draws approx 300mA but I think it's
more in the 500mA range to work properly.

9] Do you think I need a different fuse size in the holder to protect the
150 or will what I use to protect the R75 be sufficient for the 150 also?

I would expect any likely failure in the HF-150 to draw at least 5 amps,
so any fuse in the 1.6-2-3 amp area should be OK.

10] What is the difference between "GMA" and "FGB" type fuses? Is it better
to use the longer ones, the mini ones or it doesn't matter?

Without actually seeing the pictures don't use me as the ultimate
authority, but I think the only difference is physical size and shape.
--
Doug Smith W9WI
Pleasant View (Nashville), TN EM66
http://www.w9wi.com

I think you will have to experiment a little to find the lowest size
that will protect the radio without blowing out from a little current
surge. Start with the lowest value that seems reasonable and see if it
blows. If it does, replace it with one of higher value until the radio
plays satisfactorily. I think that there is some debate as to whether a
transistor will pop before a fuse but you will have done all you can to
protect the circuit.
Other problems can come from spikes and surges in the power line or
lightning hits. You want to have a good surge protector in the ac line
and for further protection, you could add a "crowbar" circuit which
protects from overvoltage.
For 100% total security, you could run the radios from a gel cell or
sealed lead acid battery and use the Astron to charge up the battery
off-circuit. The battery also has the advantage of being free of line
noise.
A lot depends on how steady your power lines are and how often you
have lightning storms.

"Doug Smith W9WI" wrote in message
...
Lucky wrote:
I have a Icom R75 and Lowe HF-150 I want to run off a Astron PSU model
SL-11a. It's 13.84V and 7Amps. Now, I have some questions please about
how to protect my radios from any mishaps from the PSU or otherwise.

Now the specs for the R75 says it's current drain at 13.80v + or - 15% is
:
Standy 0.9 Amps
Max. Audio 1.1 Amps

I bought a 2 conductor DC accessory cable that has a fuse holder on it. I
will use that to connect the PSU to the radio.
It it means anything it is 22 AWG RS part # 270-025

1] Now, what size fuse should I put in the fuse holder to make sure the
radio is totally protected from the PSU?

About 2 amps. (as a rule of thumb I would fuse a circuit at approximately
twice the maximum expected current under normal conditions) Most likely
failures will cause the circuit to draw a LOT more than the rated 1.1
amps, more than enough to blow a 2 or 3-amp fuse.

2] Am I protecting the radio from too much volts or amps or both? I
figured Amps.

The fuse protects against excessive current -- too many amps.

To be honest you're not as much protecting the radio as you're protecting
the power supply & your house. If the radio starts drawing much more than
1.1 amps, it already has a serious problem. However, without the fuse it
might cause the power supply to overheat, or (more likely) cause the
wiring to overheat, or whatever part in the radio is defective might start
smoking or even burning.

That said, you're also protecting the radio against reverse polarity.
(getting the power supply connected backwards) The radio probably
contains a polarity protection diode. If you connect the power supply
backwards, this diode limits the voltage that can appear across the radio
to less than 1 volt - but it does so by causing the radio to draw very
high currents. (at least 10 amps, probably more) The idea is that the
fuse will blow, disconnecting the voltage, before the protection diode can
get hot enough to burn out.

According to the Astron website, the SL-11A power supply has builtin
protection against excessive voltage. Actually, it's pretty similar to
the polarity protection in the radio -- if the output voltage from the
supply gets too high, a diode within the supply draws very high currents,
causing a fuse inside the supply to burn out before the attached equipment
(your radios) can be damaged.

3] I have some 250V 1.6 Amp fast acting fuses. The are 5 x 20mm GMA type
fuses. Radio Shack part number 270-1051. Are these OK? Is the main thing
the Amp rating and not the volt rating?

They're OK. They *may* be more likely to burn out (if the radio for some
reason draws a bit more current then specified) but the only consequence
is you'll have to buy more fuses. It won't damage the radios.

The voltage rating must be high enough to ensure the power doesn't arc
across the fuse if the fuse blows. A 250-volt fuse is more than adequate
for your 13.8 volt circuit. (it is possible to get 32-volt fuses that
certainly would NOT be adequate in a 250-volt circuit!)

4] The Icom Radio comes with
3 Amp FGB fuses internally and for the DC cable. Now if the radio draws
say no more then 1.1 Amps, why are they using a 3 amp fuse? Why not 1.5A
or even 2A? Why 3A?

5] So is 1.6A too low, too high, or just good? Should I go even lower to
be sure?

Probably a bit low but if it were my equipment, I'd try it.

I wouldn't go any lower, you'd probably have nuisance failures.


6] Now, the fuse in the Astron PSU itself.
Is that to protect from volt surges or amps surges?

Both. (see my answer to #2) (some power supplies don't have overvoltage
protection, in which case the PSU fuse only protects against current -
amps - surges.)

7] Do you think I'm going to extreme measures to protect my receivers
since the Astron PSU is supposed to be that good? I want total peace of
mind knowing I did all I could to protect them.

I don't think fusing the power cords to the radios is paranoia.

8] My Lowe HF-150 will use 13.80v and the same PSU also. According to
the manual it can use between 10-15V and it draws approx 300mA but I
think it's more in the 500mA range to work properly.

9] Do you think I need a different fuse size in the holder to protect the
150 or will what I use to protect the R75 be sufficient for the 150 also?

I would expect any likely failure in the HF-150 to draw at least 5 amps,
so any fuse in the 1.6-2-3 amp area should be OK.

10] What is the difference between "GMA" and "FGB" type fuses? Is it
better to use the longer ones, the mini ones or it doesn't matter?

Without actually seeing the pictures don't use me as the ultimate
authority, but I think the only difference is physical size and shape.
--
Doug Smith W9WI
Pleasant View (Nashville), TN EM66
http://www.w9wi.com


Wow good info explained simply Doug. Thank you that was nice of you. It
clears up lots of things for me. I thought I was protecting the radio more
then anything else but it seems I'm doing lots more that I didn't know
about.

I'd just like to know a couple more things please if you don't mind.

I will be using that 22AWG DC cable plus a 6 ft extention adaption cable for
the adaptaplug that RS sells. Obviously both cables are different gauges and
carrying capacities.

1] Will I compromise any of the excellent qualities of the Astron PSU or
effect how the radio receives it's voltage purely by using these differing
cables?

2] You say the higher voltage rating for the fuses keeps the power from
arcing. How is it determined what voltage rating you should use? By the
voltage that is going to flow thru the wires or by what the PSU can put out?

Thanks for being a radio buddy and helping me out. Your website looks like
it's full of other good information too.

Lucky

wrote in message
oups.com...
I think you will have to experiment a little to find the lowest size
that will protect the radio without blowing out from a little current
surge. Start with the lowest value that seems reasonable and see if it
blows. If it does, replace it with one of higher value until the radio
plays satisfactorily. I think that there is some debate as to whether a
transistor will pop before a fuse but you will have done all you can to
protect the circuit.
Other problems can come from spikes and surges in the power line or
lightning hits. You want to have a good surge protector in the ac line
and for further protection, you could add a "crowbar" circuit which
protects from overvoltage.
For 100% total security, you could run the radios from a gel cell or
sealed lead acid battery and use the Astron to charge up the battery
off-circuit. The battery also has the advantage of being free of line
noise.
A lot depends on how steady your power lines are and how often you
have lightning storms.


Hi
Yes I was thinking of that myself at first.
Try out a few and see which one does finally blow.
All Astrons have built in crowbar protection except models RS-3a, 4a, 5a and
RS-4L and 5L. That was adept
thinking on your part.

I live in Florida so we get lots of bad storms every so often. I'm new to
this but will look into gel cells as an added option.
Can't have too much fun technical stuff!

Thanks
Lucky

Put a fuse between the power supply and the battery, and between the
battery and the radios.

You might want to check around and talk with your local alarm
companies.
Many "high value" clients have the batteries changed on a yearly or bi
yearly
schedule. I have gell celss that are t least 10 years old and still
have 80 to 90% of their orignal capacity.

Terry

"Doug Smith W9WI" wrote in message
...
Lucky wrote:
1] Will I compromise any of the excellent qualities of the Astron PSU or
effect how the radio receives it's voltage purely by using these
differing cables?

No.

As long as the smallest cable is big enough to pass the necessary current,
it doesn't matter if you also have a larger cable in the circuit. I note
Radio Shack rates the 270-025 cable at 4.6 amps, so it's more than big
enough for your equipment.

2] You say the higher voltage rating for the fuses keeps the power from
arcing. How is it determined what voltage rating you should use? By the
voltage that is going to flow thru the wires or by what the PSU can put
out?

Well, both voltages (that which will be in the cables, and that which the
PSU puts out) are the same, 13.8 volts.

The voltage rating of the fuses must be at least as great as the voltage
on the circuit you're protecting. You should have a reasonable safety
factor; the voltage rating of the fuses should exceed the actual voltage
by at least 2x - i.e., the fuses should be rated at least 28 volts in your
case.

I've never seen a fuse rated at less than 32 volts, so you shouldn't have
a problem. 250-volt fuses are fine.
--
Doug Smith W9WI
Pleasant View (Nashville), TN EM66
http://www.w9wi.com


Hi Doug

Thank you once again for your knowledge. As I proceeded with the hookup
procedure, I decided to change things.

The DC cable with the fuse holder is 4Ft long. The extention Adaptaplug
cable is 6ft long. I bought both since I figured I'd keep the Astron PSU as
far from the radios as possible. So that's like 10 ft long together.

I'm going to keep the PSU under my glass/wood radio table and now 10 ft just
seems too long. I don't want uneeded lengths of wire around the radios that
cause clutter and may pick up local RFI.

So, I've decided to just go with the 6 ft of Adaptaplug cable, cut out the
fuse holder from the other 4 ft cable and solder it in line with the 6 ft
adaptaplug cable.

Problem is, I tried looking up the current rating capacity of this
adaptaplug cable. I can't find any specs on it's properties on RS's site
like it shows for the 4ft DC cable. The part # is 273-1740 for the 6 ft
adaptaplug cable I want to use for the entire length.

Do you think this cable has the needed current rating for my use? This
cable's wires are much thinner then the other cables 22 AWG size. I can't
even find the adaptaplugs cable AWG.

Can I use it safely? What do you guys think? I think most of these
adaptaplugs cables are used for wall worts.

Lucky

Lucky wrote:
The DC cable with the fuse holder is 4Ft long. The extention Adaptaplug
cable is 6ft long. I bought both since I figured I'd keep the Astron PSU as
far from the radios as possible. So that's like 10 ft long together.

I don't think there's any need to keep the PSU as far from the radios as
possible. The SL-11A is not a switching supply, so it's not likely to
generate noise. (I've not used a SL-11A but I do have a RS-20A which is
perfectly quiet.)

Problem is, I tried looking up the current rating capacity of this
adaptaplug cable. I can't find any specs on it's properties on RS's site
like it shows for the 4ft DC cable. The part # is 273-1740 for the 6 ft
adaptaplug cable I want to use for the entire length.

Do you think this cable has the needed current rating for my use? This
cable's wires are much thinner then the other cables 22 AWG size. I can't
even find the adaptaplugs cable AWG.

Probably. 1.1 amps really isn't much current; it doesn't take a very
big wire to carry it safely.
--
Doug Smith W9WI
Pleasant View (Nashville), TN EM66
http://www.w9wi.com

"FDR" wrote in message
...
Check the following link for some info.

http://www.belfuse.com/Data/DBObject/fuseprodguide.pdf

Schurter used to have a nicer guide for fuse selection.

I once had to specify fuse values for an application. The basic premise
is to choose a current value twice that of the maximum steady state. The
other way required measuring in-rush current for the first 10 ms, and then
calculating it from the values.

Fast acting fuses will blow quicker, so you usually have to rate them
higher to avoid nuisance blows.

It's always best to put a fuse after a power supply or source that can
produce high and damaging currents.

"Lucky" wrote in message
...
Hi guys

I have a Icom R75 and Lowe HF-150 I want to run off a Astron PSU model
SL-11a. It's 13.84V and 7Amps. Now, I have some questions please about
how to protect my radios from any mishaps from the PSU or otherwise.

Now the specs for the R75 says it's current drain at 13.80v + or - 15% is
:
Standy 0.9 Amps
Max. Audio 1.1 Amps

I bought a 2 conductor DC accessory cable that has a fuse holder on it. I
will use that to connect the PSU to the radio.
It it means anything it is 22 AWG RS part # 270-025

1] Now, what size fuse should I put in the fuse holder to make sure the
radio is totally protected from the PSU?

2] Am I protecting the radio from too much volts or amps or both? I
figured Amps.

3] I have some 250V 1.6 Amp fast acting fuses. The are 5 x 20mm GMA type
fuses. Radio Shack part number 270-1051. Are these OK? Is the main thing
the Amp rating and not the volt rating?

4] The Icom Radio comes with
3 Amp FGB fuses internally and for the DC cable. Now if the radio draws
say no more then 1.1 Amps, why are they using a 3 amp fuse? Why not 1.5A
or even 2A? Why 3A?

5] So is 1.6A too low, too high, or just good? Should I go even lower to
be sure?

6] Now, the fuse in the Astron PSU itself.
Is that to protect from volt surges or amps surges?

7] Do you think I'm going to extreme measures to protect my receivers
since the Astron PSU is supposed to be that good? I want total peace of
mind knowing I did all I could to protect them.

8] My Lowe HF-150 will use 13.80v and the same PSU also. According to
the manual it can use between 10-15V and it draws approx 300mA but I
think it's more in the 500mA range to work properly.

9] Do you think I need a different fuse size in the holder to protect the
150 or will what I use to protect the R75 be sufficient for the 150 also?

10] What is the difference between "GMA" and "FGB" type fuses? Is it
better to use the longer ones, the mini ones or it doesn't matter?

I really appreciate the help. The guys at Radio Shack did their best to
help me but they weren't sure.
Thank you
Lucky










Hi FDR,

I think after reading all the suggestions here, I might exchange these Fast
1.6A's for either 1.8's or 2A if that's the case. Most likely 1.8A. I'l see.

Thanks
Lucky

"Lucky" wrote in message
...

"FDR" wrote in message
...
Check the following link for some info.

http://www.belfuse.com/Data/DBObject/fuseprodguide.pdf

Schurter used to have a nicer guide for fuse selection.

I once had to specify fuse values for an application. The basic premise
is to choose a current value twice that of the maximum steady state. The
other way required measuring in-rush current for the first 10 ms, and
then calculating it from the values.

Fast acting fuses will blow quicker, so you usually have to rate them
higher to avoid nuisance blows.

It's always best to put a fuse after a power supply or source that can
produce high and damaging currents.

"Lucky" wrote in message
...
Hi guys

I have a Icom R75 and Lowe HF-150 I want to run off a Astron PSU model
SL-11a. It's 13.84V and 7Amps. Now, I have some questions please about
how to protect my radios from any mishaps from the PSU or otherwise.

Now the specs for the R75 says it's current drain at 13.80v + or - 15%
is :
Standy 0.9 Amps
Max. Audio 1.1 Amps

I bought a 2 conductor DC accessory cable that has a fuse holder on it.
I will use that to connect the PSU to the radio.
It it means anything it is 22 AWG RS part # 270-025

1] Now, what size fuse should I put in the fuse holder to make sure the
radio is totally protected from the PSU?

2] Am I protecting the radio from too much volts or amps or both? I
figured Amps.

3] I have some 250V 1.6 Amp fast acting fuses. The are 5 x 20mm GMA type
fuses. Radio Shack part number 270-1051. Are these OK? Is the main thing
the Amp rating and not the volt rating?

4] The Icom Radio comes with
3 Amp FGB fuses internally and for the DC cable. Now if the radio draws
say no more then 1.1 Amps, why are they using a 3 amp fuse? Why not 1.5A
or even 2A? Why 3A?

5] So is 1.6A too low, too high, or just good? Should I go even lower to
be sure?

6] Now, the fuse in the Astron PSU itself.
Is that to protect from volt surges or amps surges?

7] Do you think I'm going to extreme measures to protect my receivers
since the Astron PSU is supposed to be that good? I want total peace of
mind knowing I did all I could to protect them.

8] My Lowe HF-150 will use 13.80v and the same PSU also. According to
the manual it can use between 10-15V and it draws approx 300mA but I
think it's more in the 500mA range to work properly.

9] Do you think I need a different fuse size in the holder to protect
the 150 or will what I use to protect the R75 be sufficient for the 150
also?

10] What is the difference between "GMA" and "FGB" type fuses? Is it
better to use the longer ones, the mini ones or it doesn't matter?

I really appreciate the help. The guys at Radio Shack did their best to
help me but they weren't sure.
Thank you
Lucky










Hi FDR,

I think after reading all the suggestions here, I might exchange these
Fast 1.6A's for either 1.8's or 2A if that's the case. Most likely 1.8A.
I'l see.

Thanks
Lucky


By the way, do these fuse holders have a polarity where they need to be
soldered in line properly?
No of course not since you can put the fuse in the holder in either way or
direction. Just figured I ask. I mean if you're not 100% sure but are 99
9/10% sure, why not close the gap on that 1/10th and ask eh?

Lucky