This thread is started to allow anyone who believes
in "waves of average power" to say so and explain
why they believe such.
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Cecil Moore wrote:
This thread is started to allow anyone who believes
in "waves of average power" to say so and explain
why they believe such.

Thanks but in regards to radio I don't really go in for belief. I
realise that you and one or two others have a faith based approach
to antennas but I prefer to make them, measure them and then work
with them.

Thanks though


charlie.

--
M0WYM
www.radiowymsey.org

"Stefan Wolfe" wrote in
:

My MFJ tuner has a scale called "Average Power", along with "PEP".
Gosh, if my MFJ tuner has it on the dial, it exists! :-))

Well, you would believe anything.

Some MFJ tuners that have a PEP switch do not read PEP reasonably
accurately on speech. Some of them that don't work (eg 949E) have a place
on the board for the transistor amplifier that is incorporated in other
models, and they can be fixed by adding the 10 cent transistor and one or
two other parts... but it is a huge job to get the PCB out of the tuner
to do the work.

The 'Average Power' reading might be reasonably accurate on an
unmodulated carrier, but it is certainly not on a complex waveform like
speech, and is another example of MFJ's labelling. In the so-called
'average power' mode, the circuit is a half wave peak responding RF
detector with a short (wrt speech) decay time constant driving a
D'Arsonval meter movement which responds to the average current where the
current is proportional to square root of power under constant carrier.

The BS in the 'average power' story is revealed by measuring the average
power of a Morse transmitter sending continuous dits with 50% duty
cycle... the 'average power' reading instruments are unlikely to read 50%
of the key down power, and the reading is likely to vary significantly
with dit speed.

A similar experiment will reveal the failure of some of the MFJ PEP power
meters to correctly indicate PEP on the Morse waveform.

Owen

"Stefan Wolfe" wrote in
:

I guess the joke with smiley symbol was either lost on you,

You are a funny fellow... plonk.

Stefan Wolfe wrote:
"Cecil Moore" wrote:
This thread is started to allow anyone who believes
in "waves of average power" to say so and explain
why they believe such.

My MFJ tuner has a scale called "Average Power", along with "PEP". Gosh, if
my MFJ tuner has it on the dial, it exists! :-))

The average power is the joules passing a fixed
point in one second. It is the joules that are
flowing, not the watts.
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

charlie wrote:
Cecil Moore wrote:
This thread is started to allow anyone who believes
in "waves of average power" to say so and explain
why they believe such.

Thanks but in regards to radio I don't really go in for belief.

So you don't even believe in ohm's law and the
principle of conservation of energy?
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

"Cecil Moore" wrote in message
et...
Stefan Wolfe wrote:
"Cecil Moore" wrote:
This thread is started to allow anyone who believes
in "waves of average power" to say so and explain
why they believe such.

My MFJ tuner has a scale called "Average Power", along with "PEP". Gosh,
if my MFJ tuner has it on the dial, it exists! :-))

The average power is the joules passing a fixed
point in one second. It is the joules that are
flowing, not the watts.
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

its the electrons that are flowing... everything else is a figment of your
slide rule.

Dave wrote:
its the electrons that are flowing... everything else is a figment of your
slide rule.

EM waves move at the speed of light - electrons don't.
The flowing energy in an EM wave is photonic.
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

On 27 Oct, 06:23, Cecil Moore wrote:
Dave wrote:
its the electrons that are flowing... everything else is a figment of your
slide rule.

EM waves move at the speed of light - electrons don't.
The flowing energy in an EM wave is photonic.
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com

Cecil
I don't want to argue the point but as you know
I consider radio radiator to be an electron accellerator
ie a tank circuit using a full wave (slow wave) length
inductance with a very low capacitance (LC ratio).
It is well known that the electron in a accellerator
aproaches the speed of sound.
The cloud of accellerated particles or electrons
in this case is non polarized which allowes for a
tumbling straight line trajectory.
Now some will be angry accusing me of putting out
false information again or flaunting comedic writing again
but I am being serious

Is the above in conflict with your statement?

Best regards
Art Unwin KB9MZ......XG

art wrote:
It is well known that the electron in a accellerator
aproaches the speed of sound.

Speed of sound? That's much too fast for free
electrons in a wire conductor.

Is the above in conflict with your statement?

In DC circuits, electrons flow at speeds that can
be expressed in cm/min. In RF circuits they hardly
have time to move at all in one direction before
they have to start moving in the other direction.

It is the photons released by energy-rich electrons
that flow at the speed of light. The EM wave energy
is associated with those photons.
--
73, Cecil http://www.w5dxp.com