I'm new to this and need your help in selecting which antennas to use
on my railroad motorcars.

The radio will be moved between two pieces of equipment. One cab has
a flat metal roof and the other has a fiberglass cab. I would like an
antenna that I can unscrew from the cab when traveling the equipment
down the road on a trailer. The radio will be using the NARCOA
licensed frequency of 151.625 MHz. I understand that this frequency is
in what is known as the VHF-High Land Mobile Radio (LMR) Service band,
and uses a modulation known as narrow band (5 kHz deviation) FM. I
will be using a Vertex FLT 2011 40 Watt radio.

Based on the little I know about this, I understand a special antenna
will be needed for the fiberglass cab since there is no ground plane.
Both antenna will be mounted directly to the roof through a hole. The
radio will be mount within 2 feet of where this hole will be drilled
so I only need a short wire to connect from the antenna to the back of
the radio.

If you can offer me suggestions as to which antennas to use, I would
be most appreciative. Please excuse me if I misused some of the
language of the hobby.

Thanks in advance.

Dave in Pierre, SD

To see pictures of what this equipment is, go to:

www.narcoa.org

On Feb 28, 9:18 am, DVoeltz wrote:
I'm new to this and need your help in selecting which antennas to use
on my railroad motorcars.

The radio will be moved between two pieces of equipment. One cab has
a flat metal roof and the other has a fiberglass cab. I would like an
antenna that I can unscrew from the cab when traveling the equipment
down the road on a trailer. The radio will be using the NARCOA
licensed frequency of 151.625 MHz. I understand that this frequency is
in what is known as the VHF-High Land Mobile Radio (LMR) Service band,
and uses a modulation known as narrow band (5 kHz deviation) FM. I
will be using a Vertex FLT 2011 40 Watt radio.

Based on the little I know about this, I understand a special antenna
will be needed for the fiberglass cab since there is no ground plane.
Both antenna will be mounted directly to the roof through a hole. The
radio will be mount within 2 feet of where this hole will be drilled
so I only need a short wire to connect from the antenna to the back of
the radio.

If you can offer me suggestions as to which antennas to use, I would
be most appreciative. Please excuse me if I misused some of the
language of the hobby.

Thanks in advance.

Dave in Pierre, SD

To see pictures of what this equipment is, go to:

www.narcoa.org

Hi, Dave.
Sure looks like fun! Someone here in Redmond, Oregon has one of the
cars. Seen it parked on a truck and then on the ground in front of his
garage.

The antenna you want to use will in a large part depend on what
distance and over what terrain you need to communicate. If only a few
miles, then a simple ground plane antenna will work. The antenna will
add less than 18 inches to the height of the roof, so you may not need
to remove it for transport.

I am not familiar with the class of license you are operating under,
so will not comment on antenna brands or installation. This seems to
be a commercial type installation, rather than an amateur radio
installation, so a licensed installer may be needed. If so, they will
have the antenna information you need.

Best regards,
Paul, KD7HB

On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 09:18:53 -0800, DVoeltz wrote:

I'm new to this and need your help in selecting which antennas to use on
my railroad motorcars.

How doggone cool! I saw a group of cars going through the bald eagle
valley in central PA last fall. I didn't know there was a big organized
group.

The radio will be moved between two pieces of equipment. One cab has a
flat metal roof and the other has a fiberglass cab. I would like an
antenna that I can unscrew from the cab when traveling the equipment
down the road on a trailer. The radio will be using the NARCOA licensed
frequency of 151.625 MHz. I understand that this frequency is in what is
known as the VHF-High Land Mobile Radio (LMR) Service band, and uses a
modulation known as narrow band (5 kHz deviation) FM. I will be using a
Vertex FLT 2011 40 Watt radio.

Based on the little I know about this, I understand a special antenna
will be needed for the fiberglass cab since there is no ground plane.
Both antenna will be mounted directly to the roof through a hole. The
radio will be mount within 2 feet of where this hole will be drilled so
I only need a short wire to connect from the antenna to the back of the
radio.
Ideally there would be a ground plane for both, but it seems that most
antenna mounts of the mag mount variety are getting their ground from the
electrical system, then the body of the car. If the whole body is
fiberglass, you could run some wires to use as ground plane under or on
top of the roof. They won't be very long.

You might want to get an antenna that has a removeable mast so that you
can just unscrew the antenna and leave the coax cable in place. If the
whole thing has to go with the car, you'll probably want a clamp on.

re you averse to building your own antenna? a 1/4 wave ground plane would
work very well, is easy to construct if you have some soldering skills,
and is very inexpensive. Rough details are that it would take around
18.and a half inch wire for the vertical section, and 4 wires of that
length for the radials.

If you are interested in that route, let me know and we can fill you in
on the details.

To see pictures of what this equipment is, go to:

www.narcoa.org

where does one get hild of one of those cars?

--
-73 de Mike N3LI -

On Feb 28, 4:31 pm, " wrote:
On Feb 28, 9:18 wrote:





I'm new to this and need your help in selecting which antennas to use
on my railroad motorcars.

The radio will be moved between two pieces of equipment. One cab has
a flat metal roof and the other has a fiberglass cab. I would like an
antennathat I can unscrew from the cab when traveling the equipment
down the road on a trailer. The radio will be using the NARCOA
licensed frequency of 151.625 MHz. I understand that this frequency is
in what is known as the VHF-High Land Mobile Radio (LMR) Service band,
and uses a modulation known as narrow band (5 kHz deviation) FM. I
will be using a Vertex FLT 2011 40 Watt radio.

Based on the little I know about this, I understand a specialantenna
will be needed for the fiberglass cab since there is no ground plane.
Bothantennawill be mounted directly to the roof through a hole. The
radio will be mount within 2 feet of where this hole will be drilled
so I only need a short wire to connect from theantennato the back of
the radio.

If you can offer me suggestions as to which antennas to use, I would
be most appreciative. Please excuse me if I misused some of the
language of the hobby.

Thanks in advance.

Dave in Pierre, SD

To see pictures of what this equipment is, go to:

www.narcoa.org

Hi, Dave.
Sure looks like fun! Someone here in Redmond, Oregon has one of the
cars. Seen it parked on a truck and then on the ground in front of his
garage.

Theantennayou want to use will in a large part depend on what
distance and over what terrain you need to communicate. If only a few
miles, then a simple ground planeantennawill work. Theantennawill
add less than 18 inches to the height of the roof, so you may not need
to remove it for transport.

I am not familiar with the class of license you are operating under,
so will not comment onantennabrands or installation. This seems to
be a commercial type installation, rather than an amateur radio
installation, so a licensed installer may be needed. If so, they will
have theantennainformation you need.

Best regards,
Paul, KD7HB- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Paul:

Finally responding after a few weeks of being gone.

To answer some questions, the radios are usually operated from 1/2 to
5 miles apart from car to car. It can be flat wide open plains like
here in South Dakota or in the mountains with tunnels. I realize
results will vary with these differing conditions.

Here is the documentation concerning the NARCOA frequency:
=============================================
NARCOA has a license and we are authorized to operate under it.
NARCOA is licensed for the frequency of 151.625 MHz. The NARCOA call
sign is WPHT745. This frequency is in what is known as the VHF-High
Land Mobile Radio (LMR) Service band, and uses a modulation known as
narrow band (5 kHz deviation) FM. This band is reserved for commercial
activity; educational and philanthropic activity; clergyman and
ecclesiastical institutions; and for hospitals, clinics and medical
institutions. NARCOA's activities are considered to be educational and
philanthropic, and fall under Title 47, Part 90.75 of the FCC Rules
and Regulations.

151.625 MHz is specifically assigned for itinerant use. That is,
stations licensed to this frequency are not restricted to a certain
geographical area and the license does not call out specific
coordinates for base stations, but mobiles can move about within the
United States, depending on the needs of the licensee. This makes the
itinerant frequency especially suitable for NARCOA activities. (Note
that we are not licensed to use this frequency in Canada or Mexico.)
Power is restricted to 110 watts.

It is important to note that NARCOA is not the only licensed user of
this frequency. There are many licensees for the itinerant channel
ranging from truckers to hunters. FCC rules require that users of this
frequency be considerate of other users and to not interfere with
their communications. Each user is responsible for knowing and
observing the FCC regulations regarding radio usage on the LMR bands.
Each club should keep a current copy of the FCC Code of Federal
Regulations, Part 47 available for its membership. This can be
obtained from the US Government Printing Office.
===========================================

Hopefully that will answer the type of license used. I would like an
antenna that can be removed while pulling the car down the road. If
taller means better reception, that is OK with me. The antennas would
be permanently mounted on each car. It wowuld make sense to mount the
antenna on the roof of the metal topped car but could be side mounted
on the fiberglass car.

Can I purchase the needed antennas from a store and if so, can you
recommend one?

Thanks

Dave in Pierre, SD

On Feb 28, 8:58*pm, Mike Coslo wrote:
On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 09:18:53 -0800,DVoeltzwrote:
I'm new to this and need your help in selecting which antennas to use on
my railroad motorcars.

How doggone cool! I saw a group of cars going through the bald eagle
valley in central PA last fall. I didn't know there was a big organized
group.

The radio will be moved between two pieces of equipment. *One cab has a
flat metal roof and the other has a fiberglass cab. *I would like an
antennathat I can unscrew from the cab when traveling the equipment
down the road on a trailer. *The radio will be using the NARCOA licensed
frequency of 151.625 MHz. I understand that this frequency is in what is
known as the VHF-High Land Mobile Radio (LMR) Service band, and uses a
modulation known as narrow band (5 kHz deviation) FM. *I will be using a
Vertex FLT 2011 40 Watt radio.

Based on the little I know about this, I understand a specialantenna
will be needed for the fiberglass cab since there is no ground plane.
Bothantennawill be mounted directly to the roof through a hole. *The
radio will be mount within 2 feet of where this hole will be drilled so
I only need a short wire to connect from theantennato the back of the
radio.

*Ideally there would be a ground plane for both, but it seems that mostantennamounts of the mag mount variety are getting their ground from the
electrical system, then the body of the car. If the whole body is
fiberglass, you could run some wires to use as ground plane under or on
top of the roof. They won't be very long.

You might want to get anantennathat has a removeable mast so that you
can just unscrew theantennaand leave the coax cable in place. If the
whole thing has to go with the car, you'll probably want a clamp on.

re you averse to building your ownantenna? a 1/4 wave ground plane would
work very well, is easy to construct if you have some soldering skills,
and is very inexpensive. Rough details are that it would take around
18.and a half inch wire for the vertical section, and 4 wires of that
length for the radials.

If you are interested in that route, let me know and we can fill you in
on the details.

To see pictures of what this equipment is, go to:

www.narcoa.org

where does one get hild of one of those cars?

--
-73 de Mike N3LI -

Mike, I would like more details on building the antennas. I have the
skill to do so.

These speeders are getting hard to find but if you look under the for
sale link on www.narcoa.com you will see where some are for sale from
time to time. They could be purchased for $300 20 years ago, now the
same car costs $3,000. Wished I would have bought a 100 of them :-)

Thanks!

Dave in Pierre, SD

On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 09:18:53 -0800 (PST), DVoeltz
wrote:

I'm new to this and need your help in selecting which antennas to use
on my railroad motorcars.



The radio will be moved between two pieces of equipment. One cab has
a flat metal roof and the other has a fiberglass cab. I would like an
antenna that I can unscrew from the cab when traveling the equipment
down the road on a trailer. The radio will be using the NARCOA
licensed frequency of 151.625 MHz. I understand that this frequency is
in what is known as the VHF-High Land Mobile Radio (LMR) Service band,
and uses a modulation known as narrow band (5 kHz deviation) FM. I
will be using a Vertex FLT 2011 40 Watt radio.

I don't know if it will help but for the ground plane part of the
antenna, you could use a pizza pan (16 inches should do it) and find
some way to mount it on the roof of either the metal or the fiberglass
roof.


Thanks in advance.

you are welcome, but I thing I only gave you something to think and
build on.

Dave in Pierre, SD

To see pictures of what this equipment is, go to:

www.narcoa.org

Cute, but I don't think I would want to 'meet' one of those
locomotives in your car ;(

Good luck
Buck
--
73 for now
Buck, N4PGW

www.lumpuckeroo.com

"Small - broadband - efficient: pick any two."