Owen Duffy wrote:
"Hal Rosser" wrote in
:

I have also heard of buying a new chain and bar for your chainsaw,
then using the OLD one to cut a path through the yard.

In this part of the world, you can rent a Ditch-Witch or Trench-Wench which
use a similar concept, but the chain carries cutters designed for earth and
rocks rather than one designed for wet timber.

Ditch-Witchs and Trench-Wenchs aren't very good for cutting trees, nor are
chainsaws very good for digging trenches.

On the other hand, there's a big difference between a "slit into which a
cable/small conduit can be stuffed" and a 4" wide trench with a ridge of
dirt along side.

Mind you, I am a HUGE fan of the gas powered trencher, but it's a pretty
invasive approach.

You also have to really contemplate "shovel and back" vs trencher. I
had a 100 ft or so gas line installed a year ago, and the plumber just
got the shovel out and trenched it by hand in a couple of hours. That's
comparable to the time I spent going down to the rental yard, getting
the trencher, bringing it home, unloading it off the trailer, spending
30 minutes trenching for the irrigation lines, then returning it.

And I'm not sure my back was any better off than the plumber's at the
end of the day.

Granted, the trencher is nice in dense, rock filled clay, where a
"digging bar" is part of the required tool complement. The plumber had
the advantage of digging where I had previously dug some years before.

You don't have to invent a new tool for this application, plumbers and
electricians have been inserting narrow conduits / pipes in earth trenches
for decades using these types of machines.

There's also a sort of walk behind motorized plow for doing this sort of
thing. I saw one at the rental yard a few years ago. It has a sturdy
steel blade that has a sort of overall V shape, and fairly large tires
driven by a geared down gasoline motor and a bunch of ballast. I think
the advantage of this is that you can drive it across a lawn to lay a
cable or pipe and not have to do a bunch of resodding after you are done.

In any case, as the poster comments, this is a pretty standard overall
task, and there's lots of ways to do it.

An alternative to renting a machine may be to find a plumber who
specialiese in in-ground sprinkler systems... and get a quote for him to
dig your trenches.

Owen

Michael Coslo wrote:
Owen Duffy wrote:

Ah, but that rental cost is something. I'd be looking at hundreds of
dollars each time I do it. Thousands if I hire someone.

That 40 dollars I spent for the electric chansaw is cheap by comparison.
And very very quick. Yeah, it ruins the chainsaw blade and bar. At 40
dollars, I consider the whole thing disposable. I could buy a lot of
them for the price of renting the trencher.



The small trenchers rent for $35/hr in my area (4" wide x 24" deep).
There's a 2 hour minimum. You can dig a LOT of trenches in really hard
soil with lots of rocks in 2 hours. I also found out you could have
them deliver the thing and pick it up for $80 (which is a lot of money
if you happen to have a vehicle that can tow a small trailer, but if all
you have is a compact car, it's a lot cheaper than renting a truck)

In any case, not hundreds of dollars.

Jim Lux wrote:
. . .
You also have to really contemplate "shovel and back" vs trencher. I
had a 100 ft or so gas line installed a year ago, and the plumber just
got the shovel out and trenched it by hand in a couple of hours. That's
comparable to the time I spent going down to the rental yard, getting
the trencher, bringing it home, unloading it off the trailer, spending
30 minutes trenching for the irrigation lines, then returning it.

And I'm not sure my back was any better off than the plumber's at the
end of the day.
. . .

I have a hand tool that's considerably better than a shovel for cutting
a narrow slot. I think it's intended to be a manual edger. It's on a
handle like a shovel but the blade is flat, semi-circular, and
sharpened. You can push it into the ground by stepping on it, then you
can rock it to widen the slit it cuts. I wouldn't try using it here in
the summer when the ground is basically adobe, but it's reasonable in
the winter when the ground is wet and soft. I don't think it would make
a slot deep and wide enough for conduit, but you could probably use one
to get bare coax under the sod and mower.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

"Roy Lewallen" wrote in message
treetonline...
Jim Lux wrote:
. . .
You also have to really contemplate "shovel and back" vs trencher. I had
a 100 ft or so gas line installed a year ago, and the plumber just got
the shovel out and trenched it by hand in a couple of hours. That's
comparable to the time I spent going down to the rental yard, getting the
trencher, bringing it home, unloading it off the trailer, spending 30
minutes trenching for the irrigation lines, then returning it.

And I'm not sure my back was any better off than the plumber's at the end
of the day.
. . .

I have a hand tool that's considerably better than a shovel for cutting a
narrow slot. I think it's intended to be a manual edger. It's on a handle
like a shovel but the blade is flat, semi-circular, and sharpened. You can
push it into the ground by stepping on it, then you can rock it to widen
the slit it cuts. I wouldn't try using it here in the summer when the
ground is basically adobe, but it's reasonable in the winter when the
ground is wet and soft. I don't think it would make a slot deep and wide
enough for conduit, but you could probably use one to get bare coax under
the sod and mower.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

I am the original poster. I just got done using my gas powered lawn edger
and it worked fine. I had to cut 2 slits for my Direct TV cables. 1 was for
High Dev cables and the other for the digital cables. I couldn't get them in
one slit. My 2 cuts were about 35 feet long.and about 2 inches or so deep.
We had a full day of rain here in Illinois so it may the cutting easy. After
I got them in the slits I took a 3/4" board and gently tapped the cables
down in the ground. I hope that freeze this winter doesn't heave them up.
Thanks for your comments.

Jim Lux wrote in
:

On the other hand, there's a big difference between a "slit into which
a cable/small conduit can be stuffed" and a 4" wide trench with a
ridge of dirt along side.


Models are available here which cut a trench about 2" wide, and to a depth
of about 18" max, and pile the fine spoil neatly clear of the trench
(rather than in the operator's boot etc).

I have used them on electrical contracting jobs, and they work a treat.
They will cut through small tree roots, deal with small rocks, and are easy
to backfill neatly.

Owen

Jim Lux wrote in
:

In any case, not hundreds of dollars.

Some times. Some rental stores want you to have it the whole day, or in my
area, you have to have it back by noon Saturday when they close, or you get
to rent it the whole weekend.

Regardless, it's still a lot more expensive.

- 73 de Mike N3LI -

On Aug 22, 10:38*am, Michael Coslo wrote:
Owen Duffy wrote:
"Hal Rosser" wrote in
t:

I have also heard of buying a new chain and bar for your chainsaw,
then using the OLD one to cut a path through the yard.

In this part of the world, you can rent a Ditch-Witch or Trench-Wench which
use a similar concept, but the chain carries cutters designed for earth and
rocks rather than one designed for wet timber.

Ditch-Witchs and Trench-Wenchs aren't very good for cutting trees, nor are
chainsaws very good for digging trenches.

* * * * Perhaps. But I use a chainsaw none the less. I've got a cheap electric
one just for the purpose.

You don't have to invent a new tool for this application, plumbers and
electricians have been inserting narrow conduits / pipes in earth trenches
for decades using these types of machines.

Ah, but that rental cost is something. I'd be looking at hundreds of
dollars each time I do it. Thousands if I hire someone.

That 40 dollars I spent for the electric chansaw is cheap by comparison.
And very very quick. Yeah, it ruins the chainsaw blade and bar. At 40
dollars, I consider the whole thing disposable. I could buy a lot of
them for the price of renting the trencher.

I should make the standard disclaimer here. I'm not suggesting that
anyone use this method, In fact, don't try this at home kids. Anything
sharp can be dangerous, so leave everything you do to the professionals.
* (that was a disclaimer, not a jab at your sugesstions, Owen)

An alternative to renting a machine may be to find a plumber who
specialiese in in-ground sprinkler systems... and get a quote for him to
dig your trenches.

I've always had the problem of wanting to do so many things, yet my
resources are a little limited. So I get a little creative at times.

* * * * - 73 de Mike N3LI -

Ditch Witch also makes a device that looks and operates very similar
to an edger but cuts deeper
and piles the dirt neatly beside the cut.

Jimmie

On Aug 22, 3:48*pm, "Joe" wrote:
"Roy Lewallen" wrote in message

treetonline...





Jim Lux wrote:
. . .
You also have to really contemplate "shovel and back" vs trencher. *I had
a 100 ft or so gas line installed a year ago, and the plumber just got
the shovel out and trenched it by hand in a couple of hours. *That's
comparable to the time I spent going down to the rental yard, getting the
trencher, bringing it home, unloading it off the trailer, spending 30
minutes trenching for the irrigation lines, then returning it.

And I'm not sure my back was any better off than the plumber's at the end
of the day.
. . .

I have a hand tool that's considerably better than a shovel for cutting a
narrow slot. I think it's intended to be a manual edger. It's on a handle
like a shovel but the blade is flat, semi-circular, and sharpened. You can
push it into the ground by stepping on it, then you can rock it to widen
the slit it cuts. I wouldn't try using it here in the summer when the
ground is basically adobe, but it's reasonable in the winter when the
ground is wet and soft. I don't think it would make a slot deep and wide
enough for conduit, but you could probably use one to get bare coax under
the sod and mower.

Roy Lewallen, W7EL

I am the original poster. *I just got done using my gas powered lawn edger
and it worked fine. I had to cut 2 slits for my Direct TV cables. 1 was for
High Dev cables and the other for the digital cables. I couldn't get them in
one slit. My 2 cuts were about 35 feet long.and about 2 inches or so deep..
We had a full day of rain here in Illinois so it may the cutting easy. After
I got them in the slits I took a 3/4" board and gently tapped the cables
down in the ground. *I hope that freeze this winter doesn't heave them up.
Thanks for your comments.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Ditch Witch makes a trencher that is exactly like an edger except it
has a guard that piles the dirt up along side the the cut.
I have also known of people putting a concrete cutting blade on an
edger and cutting through a curb with it. Probably two things you
shouldnt do.


Jimmie

"JIMMIE" wrote in message
...
"I have also known of people putting a concrete cutting blade on an
edger and cutting through a curb with it."

Seems like a concrete blade on a regular old Skillsaw would be easier and have
more torque? Is there any advantage to the edger other than (1) not having to
get down on your hands and feet and (2) you may not actually have a Skillsaw?

"Joel Koltner" wrote in message
...
"JIMMIE" wrote in message
...
"I have also known of people putting a concrete cutting blade on an
edger and cutting through a curb with it."

Seems like a concrete blade on a regular old Skillsaw would be easier and
have more torque? Is there any advantage to the edger other than (1) not
having to get down on your hands and feet and (2) you may not actually
have a Skillsaw?


I think it would be a lot faster, but wouldn't there be a shock hazard doing
that?