On Tue, 25 Nov 2003 19:20:10 -0500, "lbbs" lbbs @dadffo.ca wrote:

I am trying to improve my TV signal. right now I have an old (made in
1995) amplifier that is connected to an TV antenna (aprox 25feet high)
mounted on my house. My amplifier is rated at 2.5w and 0.025amp.

That rating is for how much power the amplifier USES. There is no
point in trying to improve upon that (it's pretty good as numbers go).

Old or new, if it works, it pretty much works like it came off the
shelf.

I would buy a newer amplifier if I thought it would help my signal. Fist of
all I am not sure if you can get a more powerful amplifier and whether it
would help my signal. Also, I am having trouble understanding the rating
system. I looked at a new amplifier at Radio Shack and the rating system
seamed to be different now. It was rated at 10dB and I believe it mention
something about frequency. Is it better to have a higher or lower dB
number in an amplifier?

Larger number means more amplification. Odd as it may seem (this is
technical stuff) 13dB has twice the gain as 10dB. 16dB has four times
the gain of 10dB and twice the gain of 13dB. Basically, each time you
add 3dB (to any number for gain) you get twice as much as before.

Can someone clarity these points to me. They
could not explain it to me at the store.

Second question is about buying one of those omnidirectional TV antennas
that look like a flying saucer. I believe they have a built in
amplifier. If I bought one should I use it in combination with my old
indoor amplifier? Thanks a lot for your help.

Deep-six that idea and stick with an amplifier with more gain.

However, before that, make sure you have
1. good, clean connections at ALL connections EVERYWHERE;
2. the antenna pointed in the right direction (turn it 360 degrees,
you might be surprised the signal comes from a direction you didn't
think would work).
or
3. add height if that is an option.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

On Tue, 25 Nov 2003 20:05:55 -0500, "lbbs" lbbs @dadffo.ca typed:

thanks for the info. Just not sure what you mean by "Deep-six that idea"

Translation: forget about it. Deep-six refers to dumping into deep part
of the water body.

Indoor antenna don't usually work well unless you're close to a local
station (about 50 miles would be the limit) and the reception is even
lower if you live in paprtment, near big buiuldings, or have lots of
noise devices like vaccuum cleaner and refridgerator.

External attena offers better reception than any indoor antenna. If
your antenna doesn't rotate, consider a rotator. Reception greatly
improves if you aim the antenna toward the TV station.

A signal amplifier sometimes help with weak signal but keep in mind it
only amplify signal and doesn't clean up signal so you would still get
noisy picture, just not as hard to see.
--
space for rent.
To reply, change digi.mon to tds.net

question QTH ? What is your location !!
If your are more than 15 miles or less than 100 miles from your TV
transmitter a good antenna system is required, At these distances you must
point your antenna with an accuracy of +/- 5 degrees to get a good signal.
An Omnidirectional antenna works well up to about 10 miles but then so would
a coathanger . I would have to assume that you are outside or beyond a cable
TV, COGECO ? service area else why would you want to put up an expensive
$200 antenna to get one station when you can get a satellite setup for ~
$100.00. If you live in a Metropolitan Area., I can understand trying to
avoid cable fees. Your question about amplifiers fails to recognize
something called Signal to Noise Ratio a weak signal usually implies low
SNR, further amplification will bring in a stronger signal but also much
more NOISE or snow. A better antenna will improve SNR ie. a stronger signal
with the same amout of noise, noise being background atmospheric static
which is always present in any signal. I would have to assume that you must
be using a dial-up MODEM because this question doesn't make much sense if
you are using a Cable MODEM and already have access to a Cable Service


yukio


. They
could not explain it to me at the store.

Second question is about buying one of those omnidirectional TV antennas
that look like a flying saucer. I believe they have a built in
amplifier. If I bought one should I use it in combination with my old
indoor amplifier? Thanks a lot for your help.

On Tue, 25 Nov 2003 22:21:05 -0500, "lbbs" lbbs @dadffo.ca wrote:

That is why it is called omnidirectional antenna.
comparing with your earlier statement
I am trying to improve my TV signal. right now I have an old (made in
1995) amplifier that is connected to an TV antenna (aprox 25feet high)
mounted on my house.
means that you LOSE gain by the substitution (and add ghosts with the
amplifier).

If an external antenna, 25 feet high, is having a hard time, this
"omni" is NOT your answer even if it went to the top of the mast. An
"omni," by definition, has no gain compared to one with tuned elements
(presumably what you currently have). However, Radio Shack is
probably hedging their bets calling ir an "omni" as long as you turn
it 'round and 'round.

The meaning of "deep six it" is to heave it into Davey Jone's locker.

73's
Richard Clark, KB7QHC

Basically I looking for ways to improve my signal. I am satisfied with the
12 channel or so
that we are presently getting and I don't what to pay for more channel with
cable or dish.
All I want is to get a 15% improvement or so in my TV signal. I get a fair
TV signal now, but I have a couple of channel like 49 that my parents better
then us. I received a few suggestions like replace my coax with RG6 wire
and get an preamplifier at my old tower antenna. The antenna is 35 years
old at most (that is the age of our house), 15 years at best). Anything
else I can do to improve signal. I don't mind putting some money into it
since it is a long term investment. Thanks.

get better that we do.
"Yukio" wrote in message
news:nrWwb.497117$pl3.470263@pd7tw3no...
question QTH ? What is your location !!
If your are more than 15 miles or less than 100 miles from your TV
transmitter a good antenna system is required, At these distances you must
point your antenna with an accuracy of +/- 5 degrees to get a good signal.
An Omnidirectional antenna works well up to about 10 miles but then so
would
a coathanger . I would have to assume that you are outside or beyond a
cable
TV, COGECO ? service area else why would you want to put up an expensive

$200 antenna to get one station when you can get a satellite setup for ~
$100.00. If you live in a Metropolitan Area., I can understand trying to
avoid cable fees. Your question about amplifiers fails to recognize
something called Signal to Noise Ratio a weak signal usually implies low
SNR, further amplification will bring in a stronger signal but also much
more NOISE or snow. A better antenna will improve SNR ie. a stronger
signal
with the same amout of noise, noise being background atmospheric static
which is always present in any signal. I would have to assume that you
must
be using a dial-up MODEM because this question doesn't make much sense if
you are using a Cable MODEM and already have access to a Cable Service


yukio


. They
could not explain it to me at the store.

Second question is about buying one of those omnidirectional TV antennas
that look like a flying saucer. I believe they have a built in
amplifier. If I bought one should I use it in combination with my old
indoor amplifier? Thanks a lot for your help.

Hi,

Do check the coax connections at the antenna and amplifier.
If the coax you have is as old as the antenna, 10+ years,
I would replace it with rg-6 coax and cleanup the connections
at the antenna. The connections will get dirty and that give you loss
and poor signal at the start of the coax run.

How long a run do you have from antenna to your amplifier ?

Just replacing the coax can help your signal.

You also may want to verify your antenna is pointed in the proper
direction of the tv station. Over time, winds can move the antenna off
the desired direction and weather can cause the clamps to get loose.

Regards,

carl


lbbs wrote:

Basically I looking for ways to improve my signal. I am satisfied with the
12 channel or so
that we are presently getting and I don't what to pay for more channel with
cable or dish.
All I want is to get a 15% improvement or so in my TV signal. I get a fair
TV signal now, but I have a couple of channel like 49 that my parents better
then us. I received a few suggestions like replace my coax with RG6 wire
and get an preamplifier at my old tower antenna. The antenna is 35 years
old at most (that is the age of our house), 15 years at best). Anything
else I can do to improve signal. I don't mind putting some money into it
since it is a long term investment. Thanks.

get better that we do.
"Yukio" wrote in message
news:nrWwb.497117$pl3.470263@pd7tw3no...
question QTH ? What is your location !!
If your are more than 15 miles or less than 100 miles from your TV
transmitter a good antenna system is required, At these distances you must
point your antenna with an accuracy of +/- 5 degrees to get a good signal.
An Omnidirectional antenna works well up to about 10 miles but then so
would
a coathanger . I would have to assume that you are outside or beyond a
cable
TV, COGECO ? service area else why would you want to put up an expensive

$200 antenna to get one station when you can get a satellite setup for ~
$100.00. If you live in a Metropolitan Area., I can understand trying to
avoid cable fees. Your question about amplifiers fails to recognize
something called Signal to Noise Ratio a weak signal usually implies low
SNR, further amplification will bring in a stronger signal but also much
more NOISE or snow. A better antenna will improve SNR ie. a stronger
signal
with the same amout of noise, noise being background atmospheric static
which is always present in any signal. I would have to assume that you
must
be using a dial-up MODEM because this question doesn't make much sense if
you are using a Cable MODEM and already have access to a Cable Service


yukio


. They
could not explain it to me at the store.

Second question is about buying one of those omnidirectional TV antennas
that look like a flying saucer. I believe they have a built in
amplifier. If I bought one should I use it in combination with my old
indoor amplifier? Thanks a lot for your help.

I think an even 15 year old antenna could stand replacement. In any case,
the connections--especially those out in the weather--should be inspected
and probably redone, just on general principal. As other posters have
mentioned, twinlead has less loss than coax, but all of the antenna
preamplifiers that I've seen are set up for coax. A preamp mounted *on the
antenna* before the transmission line might be indicated...given that all
other components of the installation (antenna, feedline, all connections,
alignment) are up to snuff. These are readily available and generally work
well.

Back when antennas were more common, a professional would have evaluated
your situation with attention to details such as:
1) How far are you from the transmitters? (A high gain antenna is not
indicated if the stations are close by.)
2) What direction are they from your location? (If there are several
stations in several directions, an antenna rotator is indicated, even if the
distance is not great. If they are in only a couple of directions,
sometimes it's simpler to mount a second antenna to pick up the off-axis
stations. There used to be antennas available which were cut--IOW,
optimized--for a single channel. Sometimes they were available from the
station itself--not likely these days.)
3) How high is the tower on which your antenna is mounted? (Generally the
higher the better.)
4) What are the characteristics of the surrounding terrain. (You're gonna
have trouble receiving a station which is on the other side of a
mountain...or any other obstruction which interferes with direct 'line of
sight' signal transmission between the antenna and transmitter, including
buildings.)
5) What is the condition and alignment of the current installation? (It's
entirely possible that the existing antenna can be better aimed to receive
the problem station(s) more reliably. See above for condition caveats.)

jak

"lbbs" wrote in message
...
Basically I looking for ways to improve my signal. I am satisfied with
the
12 channel or so
that we are presently getting and I don't what to pay for more channel
with
cable or dish.
All I want is to get a 15% improvement or so in my TV signal. I get a
fair
TV signal now, but I have a couple of channel like 49 that my parents
better
then us. I received a few suggestions like replace my coax with RG6
wire
and get an preamplifier at my old tower antenna. The antenna is 35 years
old at most (that is the age of our house), 15 years at best). Anything
else I can do to improve signal. I don't mind putting some money into
it
since it is a long term investment. Thanks.

get better that we do.
"Yukio" wrote in message
news:nrWwb.497117$pl3.470263@pd7tw3no...
question QTH ? What is your location !!
If your are more than 15 miles or less than 100 miles from your TV
transmitter a good antenna system is required, At these distances you
must
point your antenna with an accuracy of +/- 5 degrees to get a good
signal.
An Omnidirectional antenna works well up to about 10 miles but then so
would
a coathanger . I would have to assume that you are outside or beyond a
cable
TV, COGECO ? service area else why would you want to put up an
expensive

$200 antenna to get one station when you can get a satellite setup for ~
$100.00. If you live in a Metropolitan Area., I can understand trying
to
avoid cable fees. Your question about amplifiers fails to recognize
something called Signal to Noise Ratio a weak signal usually implies
low
SNR, further amplification will bring in a stronger signal but also
much
more NOISE or snow. A better antenna will improve SNR ie. a stronger
signal
with the same amout of noise, noise being background atmospheric static
which is always present in any signal. I would have to assume that you
must
be using a dial-up MODEM because this question doesn't make much sense
if
you are using a Cable MODEM and already have access to a Cable Service


yukio


. They
could not explain it to me at the store.

Second question is about buying one of those omnidirectional TV
antennas
that look like a flying saucer. I believe they have a built in
amplifier. If I bought one should I use it in combination with my
old
indoor amplifier? Thanks a lot for your help.

Yukio wrote:
which is always present in any signal. I would have to assume that you must
be using a dial-up MODEM because this question doesn't make much sense if
you are using a Cable MODEM and already have access to a Cable Service
hmm, further investigation shows that his email ends in shaw.ca Going to
www.shaw.ca shows its a cable provider. So you have HSI?
http://www.shaw.ca/narrowband/prod_shsi_speed.html

--
BFriedl
A+ Certified Technician
AIM: UACybercat
** Bear Down Arizona! **
******* Go Cats! *******

Consider:

However, before that, make sure you have
1. good, clean connections at ALL connections EVERYWHERE;
2. the antenna pointed in the right direction (turn it 360 degrees,
you might be surprised the signal comes from a direction you didn't
think would work).

I think echos are doing me in. I have plenty of signal stregnth but it's
quite difficult getting my HDTV receiver to think it has enough signal to
build a picture. Let say I point to station "X", which is UHF. It's analog
signal is OK (some snow, but viewable, but with a few ghosts or echos..)
The same station X broadcasts HDTV from the same mast, but I can't get it.

I have found that I can pick up channels by NOT pointing the antenna
directly at the broadcast point; I can get the signal by being 90degrees to
it.

Do ghosts (echos) on a strong signal kill HDTV reception? If so, I need a
highly directional antenna (ChannelMaster 4228 8-bay)?

Alex
batsonaatcomcastdotnet

Alex Batson wrote:


I think echos are doing me in. I have plenty of signal stregnth but it's
quite difficult getting my HDTV receiver to think it has enough signal to
build a picture. Let say I point to station "X", which is UHF. It's analog
signal is OK (some snow, but viewable, but with a few ghosts or echos..)
The same station X broadcasts HDTV from the same mast, but I can't get it.


8VSB digital transmissions can be received even in a strong multipath
environment; but there is a limit and also depend upon the receiver's
ability to handle multipath. It is not unusual to receive crystal clear
digital pictures even though the analog signal, close in frequency and
transmitted from the same tower site, is severely distorted by multipath.

Keep in mind that many digital TV broadcasters are operating under an
STA (special temporary authority) from the FCC. They are not running
full power and they often use a directional antenna mounted at a height
much lower then for their analog signal. One digital broadcaster in my
area, as an example, is running 130 watts ERP with their antenna at 89
feet. I guess that that qualifies for commercial TV QRP operation