On Aug 29, 11:37 pm, " Peter" wrote:
Let me get this right...
Modulation without swing... the carrier is AM modulated,
without any "swing" in the output?

You're catching on. With VoiceMax... once you exceed the noise gate
threshold... the output of the AM(DSB) radio goes from 0% to 100%
modulation while you're speaking. This effectively doubles the output
power and holds it there while above the threshold. Therefore, the
only power shift you would see is when you transition above and below
the noise gate threshold.
www.telstar-electronics.com

"Telstar Electronics" wrote...
On Aug 29, 11:37 pm, " Peter" wrote:
How does the VoiceMax recognise 100% modulation?
Does it not simply hold it at whatever maximum the person with
the screwdriver sets the radio to? You know, the guy who you
told to crank thre radio up when fitting the VoiceMax.

Yes... Voicemax has an adjustable fast-acting limiter. During
the set up this limiter is adjusted so the output envelope
(AM) is at 100% modulation during speech.

Stop dodging the question...
It will hold it at whatever maximum modulation level the
"screwdriver expert" has set the radio at, right?
The 100% is only if the person has correctly adjusted the
radio to give 100% maximum, right?

If - due to lack of equipment, knowledge, or both - the
person sets the radio to over-modulate or splatter, the
voicmax will ensure a constant over-deviation or
splattering. No let-up.

Not only is it possible for a radio to overmodulate with
your product installed but, with the lack of technical
knowledge and proper test equipment that is common
with CB, it is extremely likely.


Let me get this right...
Modulation without swing... the carrier is AM modulated,
without any "swing" in the output?

No swing, a constant output level. Yet you have AM
modulation... output level swing.

As you appear to have ducked this one, I have to assume that
either the question went over your head or you didn't want
to admit to something.
In case it was the first reason, I will try dumbing it down...

Amplitude Modulation... The output level "swings" above
and below the carrier level.

Get it yet?

If the output level does not swing, then you have a constant
amplitude... no amplitude modulation.
No amplitude modulation = no audio. Unless, of course,
you are using FM.


Regards,
Peter.

"Telstar Electronics" wrote...

Do you really think that people would pay $40 for something
on ebay that didn't work right... and then leave positive
feedback?

Every day people are buying products or services that
do not work, then giving positive reports.

Magnetic supports, bands, etc claiming health
benefits. Then there are the cups and devices to
clamp around water pipes, claiming to make water
better for you. Another that, if clamped to your fuel
pipe claims to give your car more miles to the gallon.
Some claims include curing illness and diseases.

How about the "mediums" and ghost hunters who claim
to talk to your dead relatives? Their methods have
been publicly exposed, and they have been proved on
TV to be faking.

Many more products have been suggested as hoaxes,
fakes and scams, in spite of the fact that people claim
that they worked for them.

The craziest one of all has to be the water scam...
Some years back, in an episode of the hit Brit comedy, Only
Fools And Horses, they bottled tap water and sold it as
mineral water.
The British people found this extremely funny... until a large
American drinks company pulled that same scam on the British
public.
They bottled English tap water, gave it labels claiming health
benefits, and sold it at a pound a small bottle... probably the
highest priced "mineral water" in the country.


In spite of public exposure of deception, people continue to
believe in and even recommend such products with reports of
how they worked for them.
Some people are so desperate to believe, they only see what
they want to see - even if it is not really there.



I hardly think that's likely.

Can you say placebo?


Regards,
Peter.

"james" wrote in message...

Brian

Here is the jeopardy question for you:

In the category of electronics for $100

Name the only signal that has the same value for its peak
and average value?

If he doesn't, does the question get thrown open to the
opposing team for a bonus point?
Oh, wait a minute... you are the opposing team :~)

Now if you can answer that correctly, then you will understand
why a modulating signal that yields both 100% modulation on
its peak and its average is unitelligable.

Even if he gets it, do you think that it's in his favor to accept
the facts? His only product would become pointless, and any
money and time invested will be lost.


If you answer that then we might go onto electronics for $200.

The problem is that this subject involves more than
electronics. Human speech, hearing and interpretation
is much more than simple decibel level.

Do you really have the spare time to explain everything
to him? If so, do you really want to be faced with legal
action when his brain implodes?


Regards,
Peter.

"james" wrote...

It maybe possible to get to 100% average modulation without
overmodulation. Still such a signal is really unitelligable and not
worth the effort to achieve it. A voice so compressed that the peakto
average amplitudes are equal will more than likely yield a totally
unitelligable signal.


THE IDEA THAT SUSTAINING 100% MODULATION MAKES
SOMETHING HARDER FOR THE HUMAN MIND TO INTERPRET
IS ABSOLUTELY REDICULOUS. I FIND THE THE CONCEPT
THAT IT CAN MAKE A PERSON'S BRAIN ACHE JUST TRYING
TO UNDERSTAND SUCH SIGNALS JUST COMPLETELY TOTALLY
AND UTTERLY INCOMPREHENSIBLE. I HAVE NEVER HEARD
SUCH ABSOLUTE DRIVEL DURING MY ENTIRE EXISTANCE.
DECIBEL LEVEL IS EVERYTHING AND I GO AROUND SHOUTING
ALL THE TIME.


;~)
Peter.

- Message posted with the new TextMax text processor -

" Peter" wrote...

Ah, but wait, if Brian tells us how to do this for pennies,
how will he sell his FM splatter box to people in the UK?

Maybe I really could take some lessons from The Griffter.

I have spent years giving people good honest advice,
rather than tell them whatever they need to hear
to part with more cash.


And where has it got me?
I have been refused a job with a retailer, on the basis I
was too honest. As the advert said, they wanted an
"amateur actor" to BS customers.
And then there was the retailer who said that I was
"over-qualified", they were hoping for someone a little
more dumb.

I could even have been an Amateur... but I went and
admitted to having a father.

Speaking of Father; he can lie, cheat, bend reality and
scam his way into anything. I believe that it against his
religion to tell the truth on an application form.
He was once caught out lying in a job application but,
as it was at an estate agents, the unabashed use of the
above methods convinced them that he was the man
for the job.


If only I could be a little more like The Griffter,
maybe I could also live his wonderful lifestyle.
Mmmmm, cheese toasties.


:~)
Peter.

"Telspam Electronics" wrote...
Absolute rubbish...
If you don't have enough freq deviation... you will not get
out well on FM... and your range will be decreased.

Please, Brian, don't try telling a granny how to suck eggs.

We have had FM CB here for many years. So, I talk
not just from the theory, but from knowledge and
experience of FM CB in use and the legal situation
in this country.


Let's make this very simple for you...

Our CBs have a maximum LEGAL deviation.
This maximum is set to stop adjacent channel
interference - which DID occur on a grand
scale when the limit was higher.

UK CB radios are adjusted, and government
tested, to meet that standard.
This includes both deviation and, as the law
requires, the receiver bandwidth.

As these radios are tested before approval,
adding any internal board that alters the power,
frequencies, deviation or any other tested
specification may invalidate the approval and
make the complete radio illegal for use on
the CB band.


I suggest you review
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frequen...dulation_index
for details.

This coming from someone who, by his own admission,
cannot see how modifying the waveform suggests that
there will be distortion.
lol... lmfao.

I know about FM, modulation index, Bessel function and
sidebands.
I may not flaunt my training, qualifications and experience,
but some of us understand that this is a CB group and leave
such things at the door.

May I suggest that *you* learn a little theory? Maybe a
little on FM sidebands, so that you can see how precarious
the balance is between your notional "talk power" and the
available bandwidth of UK CB channels.

While you are at it, if you intend to target the UK
market, I would suggest that you read up on the
rules and standards.


Bottom line... if you can hold the optimum deviation
level on FM... you will get out better without splattering.

No, the bottom line is that, not only has the cheap method
worked much better on FM CB than a speech processor, it
has long been used in broadcast radio and even sound
recording.


This is extremely effective in a mobile environment.

Did you know that, here in the UK, the worst offenders
for splatter are often the truck drivers? But this could
be about to change, as CADS becomes widespread.

CADS allows the broadcast of any material - including
chanting, singing and music - on the Citizens Band. That,
with it's wide range, high frequencies, etc. is expected
to have quite an impact on splatter.

Giving either of these groups of people one of your
toys can only make matters worse. But what do you
care beyond making a fast Buck? You will not be
the one clearing up any of the mess.


Regards,
Peter.

** NOTE:
The above is not intended as an insult to any
customers or groups. CB enthusiasts only use what
some "rig doctor" or shop sells them.
The blame is clearly with those giving them bad
advice or a "supertune" just to get their money.

Why Do You Need a Speech Processor for Your CB Radio?
Two-way radio communication relies on the modulation contained within
the signal. Maintaining a high modulation level is crucial in
providing the highest possible efficiency from any transmitter
operating on AM, FM, or SSB modes. Two-way radios also rely on
microphones that inherently change audio levels delivered to the
transmitter. This causes transmitter modulation to fluctuate greatly
depending on voice level and pitch. The average modulation of a
typical voice signal is only about 40%. This low percentage applied to
the transmitter, results in less than optimal transmission range.

Other Processors Have a Problem...
Other speech processors use a low-cost "audio clipping" approach to
achieve compression. While this method is economical for the
manufacturer, clipping distorts the original signal and sounds fuzzy
on the air. What these types of audio processors gain in volume, they
lose in voice intelligibility.

VoiceMax is Different...
VoiceMax uses a sophisticated AGC (Automatic Gain Control) circuit
that installs inside your transceiver to hold the audio level
constant, with less than 1% harmonic distortion. No "clipping" type
processor can come close to this low distortion level. Whether you're
whispering or shouting, VoiceMax holds your transceiver at 100%
modulation allowing you to punch through heavy channel traffic without
sacrificing voice clarity. VoiceMax incorporates a feature not offered
on other processors. The adjustable noise gate allows the user to
block unwanted ambient background sounds. This feature is especially
helpful in mobile environments where wind and road noise can be an
issue. VoiceMax works with your non-amplified dynamic microphone to
give you tremendous audio punch without all the background noise
associated with power microphones.

www.telstar-electronics.com

Why Do You Need a Speech Processor for Your CB Radio?
Two-way radio communication relies on the modulation contained within
the signal. Maintaining a high modulation level is crucial in
providing the highest possible efficiency from any transmitter
operating on AM, FM, or SSB modes. Two-way radios also rely on
microphones that inherently change audio levels delivered to the
transmitter. This causes transmitter modulation to fluctuate greatly
depending on voice level and pitch. The average modulation of a
typical voice signal is only about 40%. This low percentage applied to
the transmitter, results in less than optimal transmission range.

Other Processors Have a Problem...
Other speech processors use a low-cost "audio clipping" approach to
achieve compression. While this method is economical for the
manufacturer, clipping distorts the original signal and sounds fuzzy
on the air. What these types of audio processors gain in volume, they
lose in voice intelligibility.

VoiceMax is Different...
VoiceMax uses a sophisticated AGC (Automatic Gain Control) circuit
that installs inside your transceiver to hold the audio level
constant, with less than 1% harmonic distortion. No "clipping" type
processor can come close to this low distortion level. Whether you're
whispering or shouting, VoiceMax holds your transceiver at 100%
modulation allowing you to punch through heavy channel traffic without
sacrificing voice clarity. VoiceMax incorporates a feature not offered
on other processors. The adjustable noise gate allows the user to
block unwanted ambient background sounds. This feature is especially
helpful in mobile environments where wind and road noise can be an
issue. VoiceMax works with your non-amplified dynamic microphone to
give you tremendous audio punch without all the background noise
associated with power microphones.

www.telstar-electronics.com

On Sun, 02 Sep 2007 05:22:25 -0700, Telstar Electronics
wrote:

|VoiceMax is Different...
|VoiceMax uses a sophisticated AGC (Automatic Gain Control) circuit
|that installs inside your transceiver to hold the audio level
|constant, with less than 1% harmonic distortion. No "clipping" type
|processor can come close to this low distortion level. Whether you're
|whispering or shouting, VoiceMax holds your transceiver at 100%
|modulation allowing you to punch through heavy channel traffic without
|sacrificing voice clarity. VoiceMax incorporates a feature not offered
|on other processors. The adjustable noise gate allows the user to
|block unwanted ambient background sounds. This feature is especially
|helpful in mobile environments where wind and road noise can be an
|issue. VoiceMax works with your non-amplified dynamic microphone to
|give you tremendous audio punch without all the background noise
|associated with power microphones.
|-------------

With all that, the dang thing is nothng more than a fancy speech
compressor. I don't care how much fluff you want to put around it. It
is still a speech compressor.

james