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#21
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From: (Frank=A0Gilliland)
On Tue, 4 Jan 2005 09:23:02 -0500, (Twistedhed) wrote in : snip Dave "Sandbagger" http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj Dave is still here? I thought he ran away to rec.boats after I trampled on his propoganda-induced delusions about Kerry's service record. Guess he was still lurking. Speaking of,,,check this out from truthout.org....... _ Ohio Recount Steeped in Fraud =A0=A0=A0=A0Democracy Week | Commentary =A0=A0=A0=A0Saturday 01 January 2005 There is something you can do. =A0=A0=A0=A0The presidential vote recount in Ohio is over - or is it? The Green and Libertarian Party candidates who paid for the recount may have a claim of fraud against election officials and at least one voting machine company. If they can't get a new recount, they ought to at least get their money back. =A0=A0=A0=A0Here's what happened. =A0=A0=A0=A0Any Ohio county did not have to do a full hand recount if a random sample of three percent of the ballots in their county matched the original count. =A0=A0=A0=A0The first fraud count: Not all the counties, if any, pulled the test precincts at random, nor did they allow the trained observers to see how the test precincts were selected. =A0=A0=A0=A0Rep. John Conyers, ranking minority member of the House Judiciary Committee, sent a letter to all the presidential candidates, in which he he stated: "At least one precinct in Medina County that would not have voting anomalies was both carefully pre-selected and pre-counted, so that the initial 3% recount that is mandated by the Ohio Secretary of State would not return a mismatch between the initial tally and the recount." [Read Rep. Conyers' Letter] =A0=A0=A0=A0Once they selected the test precincts, some counties shared that information with the voting machine technicians, who then made adjustments on the machines and gave advice on how to create an exact match. That would be the second fraud count. Technicians from Triad, the company operating many of the counting machines, visited 41 of the 88 county election offices. =A0=A0=A0=A0Triad technicians admitted that they helped the counties avoid the full recount by faking the match on the three percent count. [Read a transcript of the admissions]. =A0=A0=A0=A0When all else failed, election officials changed ballots to make the count come out right. An election official stated that she "did not want the hand count and the machine count to be different because they did not want to do a complete hand count," according to a trained observer quoted in Rep. Conyers=E2=80=99 letter. That would be fraud count number three. =A0=A0=A0=A0Mr. Conyers also wrote to Triad, asking them to provide information regarding the company's ability to control the machines remotely, which a Triad representative admitted. [Read Rep. Conyers' Letter to Triad] =A0=A0=A0=A0Fraud count number four would be that the Secretary of State, who also served as Mr. Bush=E2=80=99s state campaign chairman, refused to issue guidelines to the counties for the handling of undervotes, overvotes and other issues, a clear violation of the =E2=80=9Cequal protection=E2=80=9D ruling of Bush v. Gore. Counties used wildly different rules during the count and the recount, depriving the recount parties of true value for their investment. =A0=A0=A0=A0The same Secretary Blackwell may have been a party to the systematic violation of equal voting rights by shorting minority precincts of voting machines, while over seventy extra machines languished in a truck. The day-long lines in many minority neighborhoods cost Mr. Kerry thousands of votes, by some estimates. =A0=A0=A0=A0This article scratches the surface of what was done in Ohio to suppress and subvert the vote and render the recount meaningless. For in depth reporting, your best source is The Columbus Free Press. =A0=A0=A0=A0What Can You Do? =A0=A0=A0=A0Rep. Conyers has said that he will stand to object to the acceptance of the Electoral College vote when it arrives at a joint session of Congress at 1pm on January 6. Other House members will join him. One Senator is needed to stand with them. =A0=A0=A0=A0Senators don't want to look like lunatics. They need support from home. The most effective thing Americans can do THIS MONDAY AND TUESDAY is to print out the Conyers' letters from the links in this article, write a quick letter to the editor as a cover letter, and hand carry them to local newspaper editorial writers. =A0=A0=A0=A0If a Senator with a concern for democracy can be found, then the Ohio mess will become a major story as committees investigate and the mainstream press piles on. The chance of it overturning the presidential election is miniscule, but it will set the stage for election reforms and for the punishment of criminals in high places, and it will dissolve the notion of a present mandate. =A0=A0=A0=A0A useful cover letter would state that, regardless of party, Americans must insist on the fair and non-partisan administration of elections, and that our Senators should stand with Rep. Conyers to demand an investigation and a pledge of reform before this year=E2=80=99s election is accepted by Congress. We are too great a country to accept damaged goods instead of a reliably honest election result, or else our claims of spreading democracy to other lands is a sham. Your letter could remind the editors of how many people have sacrificed and died for our freedoms, the emblem of which is, more than our flag, our ballot. =A0=A0=A0=A0After you hand deliver the letter to your newspaper, take a copy to the field offices of your two Senators, if you live within distance. _ Also, what is going on with Nethercutt, now? |
#23
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From: (Dave=A0Hall)
On Tue, 4 Jan 2005 09:23:02 -0500, (Twistedhed) wrote: From: (Dave=A0Hall) On Fri, 24 Dec 2004 10:35:16 -0500, (Twistedhed) wrote: From: prozac 625 wrote: I don't live in "Chi Town"......... No one said you did. What "illegal CB use" are you referring to? Texas Star. What about it? Please, be specific. Channels, Channel 6. I haven't used Channel 6 since I was in a CB club that used that channel in the 1970's, (snip) Dave "Sandbagger" http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj _ On 10/09/1998, among dozens of other posts attesting to your tuning in to channel 6 and channel 11, you wrote: I know how it is on the superbowl (channel 6) and as with others on this newsgroup and on the band, when it gets too much for me I leave. |
#24
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On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 09:25:48 -0500, (Twistedhed)
wrote in : snip Also, what is going on with Nethercutt, now? Beats me. He suffered a disgraceful defeat. He's probably off pouting at some retreat for Republican losers, and Dino Rossi is headed there soon. But I have a feeling both will resurface when the 2006 campaigns get started. |
#25
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On Wed, 05 Jan 2005 10:31:16 -0500, Dave Hall
wrote in : On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 09:25:48 -0500, (Twistedhed) wrote: From: (Frank*Gilliland) On Tue, 4 Jan 2005 09:23:02 -0500, (Twistedhed) wrote in : snip Dave "Sandbagger" http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj Dave is still here? I thought he ran away to rec.boats after I trampled on his propoganda-induced delusions about Kerry's service record. Guess he was still lurking. Speaking of,,,check this out from truthout.org....... _ Ohio Recount Steeped in Fraud That's a wonderful story, if it's true. Is there any solid proof other than these allegations and he said-she said testimony to back it up? Since when would facts make any difference to your version of the "truth"? Well, maybe there's hope for you yet, so here's the best place to start: http://freepress.org/departments/display/19/2004/1057 http://freepress.org/departments/display/19/2005/1064 The paper never refuses ink, and politically motivated people have incentive to lie. That's the point. Perhaps they should do a recount in Pa.. There were all sorts of allegations of fraud in Philthy. Perhaps they may find that Bush really won Pa. as well. Then Ohio becomes a moot point. Are you sure you really want to go there? Your guy lost. Get over it..... Pay attention, Dave: It doesn't matter who won or lost the election. Kerry conceeded -- end of story. So quit invoking his name to distract from the -REAL- issue which is the huge scale of the voting fraud that happened during the election. This problem threatens the very core of this democracy, and if presidential elections can be rigged then we might as well throw in the towel. Future elections will be meaningless and open to any power-monger with enough money to buy the election, maybe even someone as diabolical as Hitler or Stalin. But I suppose you wouldn't mind such a 'leader' or how he comes to power just as long as you agree with his publically stated moral principles and objectives..... but wasn't it you that said, "politically motivated people have incentive to lie"? Get a clue, Dave. |
#27
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#28
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On Wed, 05 Jan 2005 09:54:02 -0800, Frank Gilliland
wrote: Ohio Recount Steeped in Fraud That's a wonderful story, if it's true. Is there any solid proof other than these allegations and he said-she said testimony to back it up? Since when would facts make any difference to your version of the "truth"? Well, maybe there's hope for you yet, so here's the best place to start: http://freepress.org/departments/display/19/2004/1057 http://freepress.org/departments/display/19/2005/1064 Freepress.org is a leftist propaganda organization, so it does not surprise me that they hype the negative issues to make it seem worse than it is. But you seem to have a problem differentiating between real hard irrefutable FACTS with biased editorial opinion. The paper never refuses ink, and politically motivated people have incentive to lie. That's the point. Perhaps they should do a recount in Pa.. There were all sorts of allegations of fraud in Philthy. Perhaps they may find that Bush really won Pa. as well. Then Ohio becomes a moot point. Are you sure you really want to go there? Your guy lost. Get over it..... Pay attention, Dave: It doesn't matter who won or lost the election. Sure it does. Would all these P.E.S.T. victims be screaming for a recount in Ohio if Kerry had won? That was my whole point. There were all sorts of allegations of voter fraud in Pennsylvania, particularly in heavily democratic strongholds like Philadelphia. But nobody cares because Kerry won the state, even if by less of a margin than Bush won Ohio. Kerry conceeded -- end of story. No, it's not. There are all sorts of sore loser groups trying everything from trying to throw out the electoral vote, to impeaching Bush. They just can't deal with the fact that THEY LOST. Crying voter fraud is just another attempt to deny the fact that THEY LOST. Denial is the first step. I wasn't happy when Clinton won, but I didn't accuse every state where he won of fraud (Even though, in all likelihood, there was probably some). So quit invoking his name to distract from the -REAL- issue which is the huge scale of the voting fraud that happened during the election. Tell me Frank, do you believe that there has always been voter fraud, or do you think that this is suddenly something new? This problem threatens the very core of this democracy, and if presidential elections can be rigged then we might as well throw in the towel. Future elections will be meaningless and open to any power-monger with enough money to buy the election, Like George Soros? maybe even someone as diabolical as Hitler or Stalin. Or Ted Kennedy? But I suppose you wouldn't mind such a 'leader' or how he comes to power just as long as you agree with his publically stated moral principles and objectives..... but wasn't it you that said, "politically motivated people have incentive to lie"? Yes, but you seem to think the whole issue of fraud is one sided. You scream with righteous indignation because your guy lost, not because you have a genuine concern over the voting process. Id be willing to bet that had Kerry won, you wouldn't care if allegations of voter fraud surfaced. You'd be saying to me, the same thing I'm saying to you. I also find it curious that those who seem the most opposed to putting policies in place to lessen the chance of fraud are mostly democrats. Mandatory voter ID, and a more secure voting environment have all been shouted down by democrats. They used the lame "disenfranchised" and "racism" arguments to hide their real worry that a truly fair election would hurt them. No more buying votes with cartons of cigarettes, or bottles of ripple. Get a clue, Dave. I would think that you need one as well. Dave "Sandbagger" http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj |
#29
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On Wed, 5 Jan 2005 10:43:44 -0500, (Twistedhed)
wrote: From: (Dave*Hall) On Tue, 4 Jan 2005 09:23:02 -0500, (Twistedhed) wrote: From: (Dave*Hall) On Fri, 24 Dec 2004 10:35:16 -0500, (Twistedhed) wrote: From: prozac 625 wrote: I don't live in "Chi Town"......... No one said you did. What "illegal CB use" are you referring to? Texas Star. What about it? Please, be specific. Channels, Channel 6. I haven't used Channel 6 since I was in a CB club that used that channel in the 1970's, (snip) Dave "Sandbagger" http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj _ On 10/09/1998, among dozens of other posts attesting to your tuning in to channel 6 and channel 11, you wrote: I know how it is on the superbowl (channel 6) and as with others on this newsgroup and on the band, when it gets too much for me I leave. Exact post please, not a passage taken out of context. That doesn't sound like me. I usually refer to the current state of channel 6 as the "toilet bowl". The fact that I am aware of what goes on there (my radio does have ALL 40 channels), does not mean that I USE it. Try again. Dave "Sandbagger" http://home.ptd.net/~n3cvj |
#30
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