On a sunny day (Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:11:48 -0700) it happened "Watson A.Name -
\"Watt Sun, the Dark Remover\"" wrote in
:


"Jan Panteltje" wrote in message
...
On a sunny day (Thu, 15 Apr 2004 05:57:18 GMT) it happened
wrote in :
A guy in Florida quoted 48 years pay back time. I ran
the numbers for my home - over 40 years, and I pay 13
cents per kwh. A 2 kW system costs $15000. Assuming
an average of 8 hours per day of 2kW per hour, that
solar system would give me 16 kWh. I pay 16*.13 or
$2.08 for 16 kWh. Works out to 19+ years for payback,
if you don't count on mortgage payments for the system.
Add that in, and the cost of a $15000 system is
much worse - over 30,000 in a 25 year, 7% mortgage.
You have to take into account that the cost of a kWh from
the grid in 25 years will be a LOT higher too, if there
still is a grid during and after WW3 that is.
JP

I don't blame you for being paranoid about WW3, if you're from Holland.
History has treated those countries poorly during the last WWs. But
then, who cares if there's a WW3? I'm more concerned about the next big
earthquake. Some scientists are predicting a big 6.something earthquake
in the Southern Calif. desert before Sept. I hope so, 'cause some of
these immigrants might consider going back to their point of
origination.
Yea, every place has it problems, here it is the water level, and dikes
-so flooding-.
Those imigrants are a workforce, illegal immigrants behave usually pretty
well to avoid being exposed.
I personally think they have equal rights as the native Americans who stole
the land from the Indiens (spelling?).
Zero rights? Or the right of the strongest.
Was it not Reagan who pardonned most of them in California?
Then they started paying taxes....
Was not California short of cash?
JP

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 14:54:13 GMT, Jan Panteltje
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:11:48 -0700) it happened "Watson A.Name -
\"Watt Sun, the Dark Remover\"" wrote in
:


"Jan Panteltje" wrote in message
...
On a sunny day (Thu, 15 Apr 2004 05:57:18 GMT) it happened
wrote in :
A guy in Florida quoted 48 years pay back time. I ran
the numbers for my home - over 40 years, and I pay 13
cents per kwh. A 2 kW system costs $15000. Assuming
an average of 8 hours per day of 2kW per hour, that
solar system would give me 16 kWh. I pay 16*.13 or
$2.08 for 16 kWh. Works out to 19+ years for payback,
if you don't count on mortgage payments for the system.
Add that in, and the cost of a $15000 system is
much worse - over 30,000 in a 25 year, 7% mortgage.
You have to take into account that the cost of a kWh from
the grid in 25 years will be a LOT higher too, if there
still is a grid during and after WW3 that is.
JP

I don't blame you for being paranoid about WW3, if you're from Holland.
History has treated those countries poorly during the last WWs. But
then, who cares if there's a WW3? I'm more concerned about the next big
earthquake. Some scientists are predicting a big 6.something earthquake
in the Southern Calif. desert before Sept. I hope so, 'cause some of
these immigrants might consider going back to their point of
origination.
Yea, every place has it problems, here it is the water level, and dikes
-so flooding-.
Those imigrants are a workforce, illegal immigrants behave usually pretty
well to avoid being exposed.
I personally think they have equal rights as the native Americans who stole
the land from the Indiens (spelling?).
Zero rights? Or the right of the strongest.
Was it not Reagan who pardonned most of them in California?
Then they started paying taxes....
Was not California short of cash?
JP

FINALLY! I've figured out Jan's source of news and historical
information... comic books ;-)

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 14:54:13 GMT, Jan Panteltje
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:11:48 -0700) it happened "Watson A.Name -
\"Watt Sun, the Dark Remover\"" wrote in
:


"Jan Panteltje" wrote in message
...
On a sunny day (Thu, 15 Apr 2004 05:57:18 GMT) it happened
wrote in :
A guy in Florida quoted 48 years pay back time. I ran
the numbers for my home - over 40 years, and I pay 13
cents per kwh. A 2 kW system costs $15000. Assuming
an average of 8 hours per day of 2kW per hour, that
solar system would give me 16 kWh. I pay 16*.13 or
$2.08 for 16 kWh. Works out to 19+ years for payback,
if you don't count on mortgage payments for the system.
Add that in, and the cost of a $15000 system is
much worse - over 30,000 in a 25 year, 7% mortgage.
You have to take into account that the cost of a kWh from
the grid in 25 years will be a LOT higher too, if there
still is a grid during and after WW3 that is.
JP

I don't blame you for being paranoid about WW3, if you're from Holland.
History has treated those countries poorly during the last WWs. But
then, who cares if there's a WW3? I'm more concerned about the next big
earthquake. Some scientists are predicting a big 6.something earthquake
in the Southern Calif. desert before Sept. I hope so, 'cause some of
these immigrants might consider going back to their point of
origination.
Yea, every place has it problems, here it is the water level, and dikes
-so flooding-.
Those imigrants are a workforce, illegal immigrants behave usually pretty
well to avoid being exposed.
I personally think they have equal rights as the native Americans who stole
the land from the Indiens (spelling?).
Zero rights? Or the right of the strongest.
Was it not Reagan who pardonned most of them in California?
Then they started paying taxes....
Was not California short of cash?
JP

FINALLY! I've figured out Jan's source of news and historical
information... comic books ;-)

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 08:00:57 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:


FINALLY! I've figured out Jan's source of news and historical
information... comic books ;-)

My guess would of been http://www.theonion.com/



Remove "HeadFromButt", before replying by email.

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 08:00:57 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:


FINALLY! I've figured out Jan's source of news and historical
information... comic books ;-)

My guess would of been http://www.theonion.com/



Remove "HeadFromButt", before replying by email.

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 15:13:19 GMT, maxfoo
wrote:

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 08:00:57 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:


FINALLY! I've figured out Jan's source of news and historical
information... comic books ;-)

My guess would of been http://www.theonion.com/


LOL! Probably so!

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 15:13:19 GMT, maxfoo
wrote:

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 08:00:57 -0700, Jim Thompson
wrote:


FINALLY! I've figured out Jan's source of news and historical
information... comic books ;-)

My guess would of been http://www.theonion.com/


LOL! Probably so!

...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |

I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

In article ,
says...
On a sunny day (Thu, 15 Apr 2004 05:57:18 GMT) it happened
wrote in :
A guy in Florida quoted 48 years pay back time. I ran
the numbers for my home - over 40 years, and I pay 13
cents per kwh. A 2 kW system costs $15000. Assuming
an average of 8 hours per day of 2kW per hour, that
solar system would give me 16 kWh. I pay 16*.13 or
$2.08 for 16 kWh. Works out to 19+ years for payback,
if you don't count on mortgage payments for the system.
Add that in, and the cost of a $15000 system is
much worse - over 30,000 in a 25 year, 7% mortgage.

You have to take into account that the cost of a kWh from
the grid in 25 years will be a LOT higher too, if there
still is a grid during and after WW3 that is.

That's silly economics. I do not have to take into account the
cost of electricity in 25 years. I can wait. Solar cells are
becoming cheaper too. When the cost of the solar cell is less
than the cost of power from the grid I can switch, saving all of
the negative amortization inbetween, and have a *new* system in
25 years, just as you're in need of replacing yours. ;-)

My guess though, is that solar cells for the individual will
never become cheaper than power from the grid, since the power
company has access to the same technology and a *lot* better
financing possibilities. ...and they don't have to have the pay-
back in my lifetime.

--
Keith

In article ,
says...
On a sunny day (Thu, 15 Apr 2004 05:57:18 GMT) it happened
wrote in :
A guy in Florida quoted 48 years pay back time. I ran
the numbers for my home - over 40 years, and I pay 13
cents per kwh. A 2 kW system costs $15000. Assuming
an average of 8 hours per day of 2kW per hour, that
solar system would give me 16 kWh. I pay 16*.13 or
$2.08 for 16 kWh. Works out to 19+ years for payback,
if you don't count on mortgage payments for the system.
Add that in, and the cost of a $15000 system is
much worse - over 30,000 in a 25 year, 7% mortgage.

You have to take into account that the cost of a kWh from
the grid in 25 years will be a LOT higher too, if there
still is a grid during and after WW3 that is.

That's silly economics. I do not have to take into account the
cost of electricity in 25 years. I can wait. Solar cells are
becoming cheaper too. When the cost of the solar cell is less
than the cost of power from the grid I can switch, saving all of
the negative amortization inbetween, and have a *new* system in
25 years, just as you're in need of replacing yours. ;-)

My guess though, is that solar cells for the individual will
never become cheaper than power from the grid, since the power
company has access to the same technology and a *lot* better
financing possibilities. ...and they don't have to have the pay-
back in my lifetime.

--
Keith

On a sunny day (Sun, 18 Apr 2004 08:00:57 -0700) it happened Jim Thompson
wrote in
:

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 14:54:13 GMT, Jan Panteltje
wrote:

On a sunny day (Sat, 17 Apr 2004 19:11:48 -0700) it happened "Watson A.Name -
\"Watt Sun, the Dark Remover\"" wrote in
:


"Jan Panteltje" wrote in message
...
On a sunny day (Thu, 15 Apr 2004 05:57:18 GMT) it happened
wrote in :
A guy in Florida quoted 48 years pay back time. I ran
the numbers for my home - over 40 years, and I pay 13
cents per kwh. A 2 kW system costs $15000. Assuming
an average of 8 hours per day of 2kW per hour, that
solar system would give me 16 kWh. I pay 16*.13 or
$2.08 for 16 kWh. Works out to 19+ years for payback,
if you don't count on mortgage payments for the system.
Add that in, and the cost of a $15000 system is
much worse - over 30,000 in a 25 year, 7% mortgage.
You have to take into account that the cost of a kWh from
the grid in 25 years will be a LOT higher too, if there
still is a grid during and after WW3 that is.
JP

I don't blame you for being paranoid about WW3, if you're from Holland.
History has treated those countries poorly during the last WWs. But
then, who cares if there's a WW3? I'm more concerned about the next big
earthquake. Some scientists are predicting a big 6.something earthquake
in the Southern Calif. desert before Sept. I hope so, 'cause some of
these immigrants might consider going back to their point of
origination.
Yea, every place has it problems, here it is the water level, and dikes
-so flooding-.
Those imigrants are a workforce, illegal immigrants behave usually pretty
well to avoid being exposed.
I personally think they have equal rights as the native Americans who stole
the land from the Indiens (spelling?).
Zero rights? Or the right of the strongest.
Was it not Reagan who pardonned most of them in California?
Then they started paying taxes....
Was not California short of cash?
JP

FINALLY! I've figured out Jan's source of news and historical
information... comic books ;-)
Wrong again, as first hand experience working in California
I KNOW how it is.
I ALSO know what a jail full of illegal Mexicans looks like from the inside.
So you better stop joking, I probably know US better then you.
And no I am not a Mexican.
That was the south border, I can also tell you about the north border.
Now go and dream on, dream dream dream the US dream my friend.
JP