On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 13:56:34 GMT, (Don
Pearce) wrote:

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 13:42:19 +0000, Paul Burridge
wrote:

The power company run a line to my house. They supply me with
electricity. This amounts to a 230V, 65A facility at the distribution
board in a cupboard under the stairs. I run all my stuff from that
board. The board contains several RCBOs that trip-out in the event of
any leakage current being sensed. If current in = current out; they're
happy and won't trip. Because they don't trip out, I conclude I don't
use any current.
The voltage supplied is 230VAC RMS. Since this is alternating between
equal positive and negative half-cycles, the average level of this
voltage supply is zero.
I use no current and they effectively supply no voltage. Why do I get
billed for electricity usage when I clearly can't have used any?

You don't get billed for current, you get billed for energy - in the
UK the measure is the kilowatt hour. Multiply your voltage by your
current instant by instant, take the average (gives you power) and
multiply that by the duration in hours and you have your consumption.



Er, ????

You get billed for "Power Consumed" which is covered under the
umbrella of "Energy". Now POWER is consumed when a voltage potential
causes a current to flow in a circuit. If that circuit happens to be
through a heater or refrigerator then CURRENT flows. Since the supply
voltage is constant (or should be) then the load requirement
determines the current which flows and in some cases it will be small
and in others it will be large. Now since CURRENT x VOLTAGE = POWER,
you do get charged for CURRENT usage and the amount you get charged
varies dependant upon how much current flows and for how long.

"Paul Burridge" wrote in message
...
The power company run a line to my house. They supply me with
electricity. This amounts to a 230V, 65A facility at the distribution
board in a cupboard under the stairs. I run all my stuff from that
board. The board contains several RCBOs that trip-out in the event of
any leakage current being sensed. If current in = current out; they're
happy and won't trip. Because they don't trip out, I conclude I don't
use any current.
The voltage supplied is 230VAC RMS. Since this is alternating between
equal positive and negative half-cycles, the average level of this
voltage supply is zero.
I use no current and they effectively supply no voltage. Why do I get
billed for electricity usage when I clearly can't have used any?

There is a minimum charge, regardless of energy usage.

Bill W0IYH

"News" wrote in message
...

"Paul Burridge" wrote in message
...
The power company run a line to my house. They supply me with
electricity. This amounts to a 230V, 65A facility at the distribution
board in a cupboard under the stairs. I run all my stuff from that
board. The board contains several RCBOs that trip-out in the event of
any leakage current being sensed. If current in = current out; they're
happy and won't trip. Because they don't trip out, I conclude I don't
use any current.
The voltage supplied is 230VAC RMS. Since this is alternating between
equal positive and negative half-cycles, the average level of this
voltage supply is zero.
I use no current and they effectively supply no voltage. Why do I get
billed for electricity usage when I clearly can't have used any?

There is a minimum charge, regardless of energy usage.

Bill W0IYH

test again

Bill W0IYH


"News" wrote in message
...

"News" wrote in message
...

"Paul Burridge" wrote in message
...
The power company run a line to my house. They supply me with
electricity. This amounts to a 230V, 65A facility at the distribution
board in a cupboard under the stairs. I run all my stuff from that
board. The board contains several RCBOs that trip-out in the event of
any leakage current being sensed. If current in = current out; they're
happy and won't trip. Because they don't trip out, I conclude I don't
use any current.
The voltage supplied is 230VAC RMS. Since this is alternating between
equal positive and negative half-cycles, the average level of this
voltage supply is zero.
I use no current and they effectively supply no voltage. Why do I get
billed for electricity usage when I clearly can't have used any?

There is a minimum charge, regardless of energy usage.

Bill W0IYH

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 13:42:19 +0000, Paul Burridge
wrote:

The power company run a line to my house. They supply me with
electricity. This amounts to a 230V, 65A facility at the distribution
board in a cupboard under the stairs. I run all my stuff from that
board. The board contains several RCBOs that trip-out in the event of
any leakage current being sensed. If current in = current out; they're
happy and won't trip. Because they don't trip out, I conclude I don't
use any current.
The voltage supplied is 230VAC RMS. Since this is alternating between
equal positive and negative half-cycles, the average level of this
voltage supply is zero.
I use no current and they effectively supply no voltage. Why do I get
billed for electricity usage when I clearly can't have used any?

---
For a purely resistive load, since P = I²R, the sign of the current
going into the load gets squared, so that when it goes in negative it
comes out positive.

For a reactive load, you don't get charged for the imaginary current,
(at least in the US we don't) so you get charged for what you use.

--
John Fields

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 09:57:13 -0600, John Fields
wrote:

For a purely resistive load, since P = I²R, the sign of the current
going into the load gets squared, so that when it goes in negative it
comes out positive.

Seems like there's an opportunity for free energy kooks there.
Put positive and negative current in alternately, averaging zero,
but get all positive power. :-)

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 13:42:19 +0000, Paul Burridge wrote:

The power company run a line to my house. They supply me with
electricity. This amounts to a 230V, 65A facility at the distribution
board in a cupboard under the stairs. I run all my stuff from that
board. The board contains several RCBOs that trip-out in the event of
any leakage current being sensed. If current in = current out; they're
happy and won't trip. Because they don't trip out, I conclude I don't
use any current.
The voltage supplied is 230VAC RMS. Since this is alternating between
equal positive and negative half-cycles, the average level of this
voltage supply is zero.
I use no current and they effectively supply no voltage. Why do I get
billed for electricity usage when I clearly can't have used any?

What you want to do is take an extension cord, plug it into an outlet on
one side of the house, and plug the other end into an outlet on the other
side (carefully observing polarity), thereby sending their own electricity
back to them, running the wattmeter backwards and nulling out any billable
KWH.


Bob

BTW, just in case, this is a *JOKE*, and it wasn't me telling it.

Bob Stephens schrieb:

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 13:42:19 +0000, Paul Burridge wrote:


The power company run a line to my house. They supply me with
electricity. This amounts to a 230V, 65A facility at the distribution
board in a cupboard under the stairs. I run all my stuff from that
board. The board contains several RCBOs that trip-out in the event of
any leakage current being sensed. If current in = current out; they're
happy and won't trip. Because they don't trip out, I conclude I don't
use any current.
The voltage supplied is 230VAC RMS. Since this is alternating between
equal positive and negative half-cycles, the average level of this
voltage supply is zero.
I use no current and they effectively supply no voltage. Why do I get
billed for electricity usage when I clearly can't have used any?


What you want to do is take an extension cord, plug it into an outlet on
one side of the house, and plug the other end into an outlet on the other
side (carefully observing polarity), thereby sending their own electricity
back to them, running the wattmeter backwards and nulling out any billable
KWH.


Bob

BTW, just in case, this is a *JOKE*, and it wasn't me telling it.

It might just work if you plug it into your neighbour's house...

Markus

Quite right. Call the electric company and tell them you want only
half-cycles starting immediately. If they persist in sending you an
average of zero, you will start paying your bill with a combination of
payment and charge back. That should straighten them out.

The way it was explained to me, the electric company sends you the stuff on one
wire, but it goes right back to them on the other wire. You should only be
paying a small rental fee, as you don't get to keep any of it, and they keep
re-selling the same electricity back to you and everyone else.

Doug Moore KB9TMY

On 12 Nov 2004 16:34:12 GMT, (Troglodite) wrote:

The way it was explained to me, the electric company sends you the stuff on one
wire, but it goes right back to them on the other wire. You should only be
paying a small rental fee, as you don't get to keep any of it, and they keep
re-selling the same electricity back to you and everyone else.

Doug Moore KB9TMY

Thanks, Doug. I'm glad *someone* here has some sense!
And another thing: many of us here in Britland use earthed neutrals,
so the power co. gets it's current back via earth alone. I don't mind
my own current being returned via my own garden, but why the hell
should everybody else's' current pass through my land en route back to
the power station? If the telephone company wanted to run a line over
my property, they'd have to pay me for the privilege (it's called a
"wayleave") but the power co. are paying me *nothing* for all the
other customers' earth returns running via my garden. What a rip off!

--

"What is now proved was once only imagin'd." - William Blake, 1793.