On Jan 29, 3:32�pm, Dave Heil wrote:
KH6HZ wrote:
"Bob Brock" writes:

In response to "Dee Flint" :

Right. *Radio Shack pimps the hot products for the moment. The way I see
it, them not even carrying license manuals speaks volumes about demand for
them. *Now, when you walk into a Radio Shack and see loads of HF antennas,
HF rigs, and a shelf of study guides; then you can say that Ham radio is
back in demand.

Radio Shack cannot compete with big discount houses like HRO.I disagree, Mike. *Radio Shack had its roots in selling amateur
equipment when it was a Boston firm decades back. *When Tandy bought it,
it in good shape. *It swallowedAlliedElectronics back around 1970 and
either closed or turned into Radio Shack stores, all of theAllied
retail outlets. *It owns and operatesAlliedElectronics as an
industrial distributor. *Right now the company is in search of itself.

Really? Wow, Allied is LYING to us!

I just pulled down the 2007 Allied catalog from the shelf, the one
that arrived at the end of last year. 2,192 pages, 8 1/2 x 11
format. It's about 2 13/16 inch thick. I looked at the corporate
address on the back page:

Allied
An Electrocomponents Company
7410 Pebble Drive
Fort Worth TX 76116

I've ordered from them via Internet. As a result I'm on their
"announcements" e-mail list. I remember Allied from its
beginning days in Chicago, IL. Back in 1956 they had a
large store there selling 1956-era electronic parts. Can't see
a thing about "Tandy" in that catalog.

I was unaware that they were once a "ham radio supplier."
All the time I thought they supplied parts to the electronics
industry. Thanks for clearing that up.

It's always a treat to hop in here and get the "real low-down"
from the ...

Oh, and that 2007 Allied catalog sits next to the Mouser 2006
catalog #628...almost as big in size and pages. Those two
sit next to the Jameco February 2007 catalog, not as big but
sure looks like it is going to be a very big distributor some day.

It's nice to see all those distributors have "found themselves."

Regardez,
LA

"Bob Brock" wrote in message
news:_Eovh.2876$ch1.1567@bigfe9...

"Dee Flint" wrote in message
. ..

"Bob Brock" wrote in message
...
On 28 Jan 2007 13:11:46 -0800, "
wrote:


Not at all, John, you be wrong there. ARRL has periodical and
publication racks on the floors of HRO and Radio Shack and
other stores to catch all eyes.

Not really trying to change the subject, but I went to the local
bookstore and two Radio Shacks trying to get a copy of the General
Class Study manual. Both Radio Shacks said that they no longer carry
the study guides. So, I opted to download the questions and answers
from the net for free and give that a shot.

Did two Radio Shack managers lie to me? Has anyone seen the ARRL
study guides? I didn't even see any of the "Now Your's Talking" books
at the local stores.

Radio Shack has basically gotten out of amateur radio. I haven't seen
any study guides there for a couple of years. Sometimes you can get them
at Barnes & Noble but you have to special order. In that case one might
as well order directly off the ARRL website.

The Technician license manual is no longer called "Now You're Talking".
I don't recall the new name.

Right. Radio Shack pimps the hot products for the moment. The way I see
it, them not even carrying license manuals speaks volumes about demand for
them. Now, when you walk into a Radio Shack and see loads of HF antennas,
HF rigs, and a shelf of study guides; then you can say that Ham radio is
back in demand.

So, to bring this back on topic. I wonder if the intent of the average ham
is to make ham radio grow or to maintain a stale status quo? The way I
see it, a steady increase in qualified hams is a good thing. Ham radio
needs a good infusion of new blood and the no-code tech license as a good
start. However, it was only the beginning.


It will be very tough to grow ham radio. We've "saturated the market" so to
speak. If you check around the internet (for example, Speroni's site is
one), you can find the statistics on a few of the other countries. We have
2 hams per thousand people while Europe is running more like 1 ham per
thousand people. While we need to actively recruit, there just aren't a lot
of people out there that are inclined to amateur radio as a part of their
leisure pursuits. We will have to recruit hard just to stay at the current
level. It would not surprise me if our numbers dropped in half over the
next decade or so before leveling out.

Dee, N8UZE

"Bob Brock" wrote in message
news:CFovh.2878$ch1.1742@bigfe9...

"KH6HZ" wrote in message
...
"Dee Flint" wrote:

Radio Shack has basically gotten out of amateur radio. I haven't
seen any study guides there for a couple of years.

Me either. Radio Shack is pretty much cheaply-made, overpriced consumer
electronics these days. I go in there sparingly, it seems every 6 months
their focus seems to change. I think the last radio shack I went into had
50-75% of the store's floor space devoted to various cell phone
accessories.

If any of them have ham radio manuals laying around, it is probably old
stock they haven't sold.

I believe for most people, the only viable option for buying a study
guide would be thru the ARRL or one of the other online sources, like
W5YI.

That says a lot about the growth of ham radio doesn't it?


Not really. It says more about the fact that stores across the board have
little interest in serving the niche markets. Once upon a time, Radio Shack
did cater to hams. At that time not only were the hams fewer in number than
today but they were also a smaller percentage of the population than now.
At the time, Radio Shack did serve the niche market of hams (among others).
But time has marched on and most businesses can't serve the niche markets
cost effectively.

Ham radio isn't the only area where one must resort to the Internet to find
the products they want.

Dee, N8UZE

"Bob Brock" wrote:

Perhaps when HRO has the floor space of Radio Shack, you might have
a point.

HRO doesn't compete against Radio Shack in the same market. Radio Shack is
consumer goods, HRO sells in a niche market. Radio Shack is retail, HRO is
mainly mail order.

Dee Flint wrote:

...

www.ebay.com ???

regards,
JS

On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 22:30:06 -0500, "KH6HZ" wrote:

"Bob Brock" wrote:

Perhaps when HRO has the floor space of Radio Shack, you might have
a point.

HRO doesn't compete against Radio Shack in the same market. Radio Shack is
consumer goods, HRO sells in a niche market. Radio Shack is retail, HRO is
mainly mail order.

And that was my point. If it reaches the stage where radio shack (or
Wal-Mart) has jumped on the band wagon, we may need to worry about
overpopulating the bands. As long as the only place to find equipment
is pretty much mail order to a "niche market," growth is good. BTW,
there was a time that Radio Shack targeted a "niche market." However,
those times are long past. IMO, their products were poorly made knock
offs of good equipment.

The other option is for the last ham to turn off the lights before he
dies out and the bands are sold to commercial interests.

On 29 Jan 2007 16:44:02 -0800, "
wrote:



On Jan 29, 3:32?pm, Dave Heil wrote:
KH6HZ wrote:
"Bob Brock" writes:

In response to "Dee Flint" :

Right. adio Shack pimps the hot products for the moment. The way I see
it, them not even carrying license manuals speaks volumes about demand for
them. ow, when you walk into a Radio Shack and see loads of HF antennas,
HF rigs, and a shelf of study guides; then you can say that Ham radio is
back in demand.

Radio Shack cannot compete with big discount houses like HRO.I disagree, Mike. adio Shack had its roots in selling amateur
equipment when it was a Boston firm decades back. hen Tandy bought it,
it in good shape. t swallowedAlliedElectronics back around 1970 and
either closed or turned into Radio Shack stores, all of theAllied
retail outlets. t owns and operatesAlliedElectronics as an
industrial distributor. ight now the company is in search of itself.

Really? Wow, Allied is LYING to us!

I just pulled down the 2007 Allied catalog from the shelf, the one
that arrived at the end of last year. 2,192 pages, 8 1/2 x 11
format. It's about 2 13/16 inch thick. I looked at the corporate
address on the back page:

Allied
An Electrocomponents Company
7410 Pebble Drive
Fort Worth TX 76116

I've ordered from them via Internet. As a result I'm on their
"announcements" e-mail list. I remember Allied from its
beginning days in Chicago, IL. Back in 1956 they had a
large store there selling 1956-era electronic parts. Can't see
a thing about "Tandy" in that catalog.

I was unaware that they were once a "ham radio supplier."
All the time I thought they supplied parts to the electronics
industry. Thanks for clearing that up.

It's always a treat to hop in here and get the "real low-down"
from the ...

Sometimes it's easier to just do a quick Google search and you find
things like this...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied_Radio

Allied Radio would change ownership in 1970 when Radio Shack's parent
company (Tandy Corporation) bought both Allied Radio & Allied
Electronics. The retail division was merged with Tandy's retail unit
to become Allied Radio Shack, with the main office of both divisions
moving to Fort Worth, Texas. But as a result of the merger, many major
shopping centers would have two Allied Radio Shack stores competing
for the same dollars. As a result, the former Allied Radio storefronts
would fade away, with the former Radio Shack stores taking on both
product lines (and the expense of the extra inventory.) This was in
some ways a more difficult task as the original Radio Shack
storefronts were typically smaller than the Allied Radio stores.

By 1973 due directly to federal court action, Tandy was ordered to
divest itself of Allied Radio, but by that time with the purging of
duplicate stock and closing of low volume stores, there was very
little left to sell off, and the Tandy stores would once again bear
the Radio Shack name.

Since Tandy did not have a commercial-industrial supply division,
Allied Electronics would continue as a "Division of Tandy Corporation"
that served the manufacturing sector until the mid-1980s when it began
to change owners.




Oh, and that 2007 Allied catalog sits next to the Mouser 2006
catalog #628...almost as big in size and pages. Those two
sit next to the Jameco February 2007 catalog, not as big but
sure looks like it is going to be a very big distributor some day.

It's nice to see all those distributors have "found themselves."

Regardez,
LA

wrote:

On Jan 29, 3:32�pm, Dave Heil wrote:
KH6HZ wrote:
"Bob Brock" writes:
In response to "Dee Flint" :
Right. �Radio Shack pimps the hot products for the moment. The way I see
it, them not even carrying license manuals speaks volumes about demand for
them. �Now, when you walk into a Radio Shack and see loads of HF antennas,
HF rigs, and a shelf of study guides; then you can say that Ham radio is
back in demand.
Radio Shack cannot compete with big discount houses like HRO.I disagree, Mike. �Radio Shack had its roots in selling amateur
equipment when it was a Boston firm decades back. �When Tandy bought it,
it in good shape. �It swallowedAlliedElectronics back around 1970 and
either closed or turned into Radio Shack stores, all of theAllied
retail outlets. �It owns and operatesAlliedElectronics as an
industrial distributor. �Right now the company is in search of itself.

Really? Wow, Allied is LYING to us!

I just pulled down the 2007 Allied catalog from the shelf, the one
that arrived at the end of last year. 2,192 pages, 8 1/2 x 11
format. It's about 2 13/16 inch thick. I looked at the corporate
address on the back page:

Allied
An Electrocomponents Company
7410 Pebble Drive
Fort Worth TX 76116

Here you go from the company's web site, Leonard.

quote
Allied History
Over the years, Allied Electronics has built an enviable reputation as a
distributor of electronic components.

Since our conception in 1928, Allied’s main pursuit, and now our legacy,
has been providing excellence through customer service. Now, as part of
the Electrocomponents Group, Allied has added a global presence to our
customer orientation – the latest chapter in our fascinating, eight
decade history.

1928: Allied Radio was established as the radio parts distribution arm
of Columbia Radio Corporation. The company was soon to become one of the
most recognizable names in the electronics industry.

1932: The company built a growing business in marketing radio parts and
kits to home hobbyists, and was one of the first to sell electronics
through a catalog. In addition, Allied opened storefront distribution
outlets to reach more amateur ham radio operators and experimenters.

1941-45: Having survived the depression, Allied focused on the war
effort, primarily servicing government contracts and high-priority
industrial orders. Allied gained experience in the industrial arena for
the first time through government and military contracts, which laid the
groundwork for the distribution niche we occupy today.

1946-60: The electronics industry exploded as new developments in
electronics were adopted on a widespread basis in commerce and industry.
Innovations such as television, industrial automation, space technology
and defense accelerated the need for electronics. Consumer demand also
grew as radio sets and components not available during the war
proliferated. During this exciting era, Allied gained both the
experience and specialized staff necessary to handle both consumer and
industrial sales.

1962: The first industrial catalog for Allied Electronics, a subsidiary
of Allied Radio, was released. The company continued to serve both
amateur and professional ham radio operators as one of the few places to
locate that “hard to get� piece of radio equipment.

1970: Allied moved its headquarters from Chicago, Illinois to Fort
Worth, Texas.

1981: Allied began the process of moving from an all manual system to a
fully computerized company. The process was completed in 1985.

1995: Allied is the first electronics distribution company to come out
with a CD-ROM catalog and quickly followed-up by entering the e-commerce
arena with the launch of a web site.

1999: Allied Electronics acquired by Electrocomponents of the United
Kingdom.

2000 & Beyond: The combination of Allied's commitment to a high level of
customer service and Electrocomponents’ global reach delivers a very
powerful supply chain solution to meet future customer demands.
unquote

So, as you can see, Leonard, the company was sold by Tandy to an outfit
in the UK. There is still some tie to Radio Shack as there a link on
the site featuring the Radio Shack "RS" logo.



I've ordered from them via Internet. As a result I'm on their
"announcements" e-mail list.

You can't imagine how happy this news of yours makes me, Len. When I
was an outside salesman for the firm, it was owned by Tandy.

I remember Allied from its
beginning days in Chicago, IL.

You couldn't possibly remember as you can see from the company history.

Back in 1956 they had a
large store there selling 1956-era electronic parts. Can't see
a thing about "Tandy" in that catalog.

Allied wasn't owned by Tandy in 1956. If you've been reading along,
Allied was acquired by Tandy in 1970.

I was unaware that they were once a "ham radio supplier."

They sold *all* of it: Collins, Hallicrafters, Drake, Central
Electronics, Johnson, Ameco, Hammarlund, etc. My first amateur radio
equipment was bought from their used equipment list. Of course Allied
pushed their own "Knight" brand as well.

All the time I thought they supplied parts to the electronics
industry. Thanks for clearing that up.

They did that very well until Tandy took over. That began the downhill
slide for Allied.

It's always a treat to hop in here and get the "real low-down"
from the ...

It is evident that I knew more about the company than you. Always glad
to help fill in the gaps in your knowledge.

Oh, and that 2007 Allied catalog sits next to the Mouser 2006
catalog #628...almost as big in size and pages. Those two
sit next to the Jameco February 2007 catalog, not as big but
sure looks like it is going to be a very big distributor some day.

I'm pleased to hear of the very good organization of your catalog shelf.
My congratulations on your hard work.

It's nice to see all those distributors have "found themselves."

Are you going to attempt lecturing me about the electronics distribution
business too, Len? It'll be just one more thing in which I've been a
participant and you have not.

Regardez,
LA

Dave K8MN

From: Bob Brock on Mon, Jan 29 2007 11:10 pm

On 29 Jan 2007 16:44:02 -0800, " wrote:
On Jan 29, 3:32?pm, Dave Heil wrote:
KH6HZ wrote:
"Bob Brock" writes:

In response to "Dee Flint" :

Right. adio Shack pimps the hot products for the moment. The way I see
it, them not even carrying license manuals speaks volumes about demand for
them. ow, when you walk into a Radio Shack and see loads of HF antennas,
HF rigs, and a shelf of study guides; then you can say that Ham radio is
back in demand.

Radio Shack cannot compete with big discount houses like HRO.I disagree, Mike. adio Shack had its roots in selling amateur
equipment when it was a Boston firm decades back. hen Tandy bought it,
it in good shape. t swallowedAlliedElectronics back around 1970 and
either closed or turned into Radio Shack stores, all of theAllied
retail outlets. t owns and operatesAlliedElectronics as an
industrial distributor. ight now the company is in search of itself.

Really? Wow, Allied is LYING to us!

I just pulled down the 2007 Allied catalog from the shelf, the one
that arrived at the end of last year. 2,192 pages, 8 1/2 x 11
format. It's about 2 13/16 inch thick. I looked at the corporate
address on the back page:

Allied
An Electrocomponents Company
7410 Pebble Drive
Fort Worth TX 76116

I've ordered from them via Internet. As a result I'm on their
"announcements" e-mail list. I remember Allied from its
beginning days in Chicago, IL. Back in 1956 they had a
large store there selling 1956-era electronic parts. Can't see
a thing about "Tandy" in that catalog.

I was unaware that they were once a "ham radio supplier."
All the time I thought they supplied parts to the electronics
industry. Thanks for clearing that up.

It's always a treat to hop in here and get the "real low-down"
from the ...

Sometimes it's easier to just do a quick Google search and you find
things like this...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allied_Radio

Bob, thanks for the "Wiki-up" on Allied, including Allied Radio.

If you haven't been here for years, you might not understand
how Heil's "game" is played. :-) Let me explain:

A long time ago, in a State department far away, Heil got
totally ****ed with me in here for not going overboard
with gratuitous praise and congratulations on his mighty
efforts at hamming embassies in the middle of Africa.
Especially Guinea-Bisseau. Since then he's seen fit to
"correct" me as much as possible. Gotta love it when he
tries SO hard! :-) [he *IS* a code-tested extra and
thus very "superior"]

I am not interested in ALLIED (Radio or by the single name)
corporate history. I'm only interested in the parts they
sell, the price for those parts, and whether or not they
have them in stock. So much the better if the signs point
to them staying in business over a year from now. If not,
I look for another distributor that sells in small to large
quantities (there are many of them in the USA and Canada).
No sweat there.

I am well acquainted with "Allied Radio" and actually was
in there store in the second week of February, 1956, my
Dad with me (I had gone along with his meeting of some
model industry supers, then to Fort Sheridan to see if
my footlocker had arrived yet...it hadn't). Large store
interior but almost entirely displays of parts and some
instruments, which made me a bit disappointed in a way.
Expected more. I had ordered "radio parts" from them
in 1948 and then in 1954 while in the Army in Japan, had
always seen their ads in publications of that time. [I
built a thermin for a buddy in '54, he being a music
instructor in civilian life] Allied Radio catalogs were
very thin in those days, perhaps the thickest I remember
is around 3/8 inch. Yes, they has "radio parts" but
their market was mainly industry and the electronic
hobbies went beyond radio then. Chicago was "far away"
at 90 miles before I entered the Army. :-)

ALLIED's 2007 catalog is BIG at over 2000 pages. I'm not
going to look at "all" of them to see if "Tandy" is
mentioned despite Heil's insistence that 20-year-old
corporate history is SOOOOO important! :-) ALLIED is
very much IN BUSINESS and looks to stay that way for a
long time. By e-mail or by voice telephone the staff is
nice and obliging, on-the-job...no detectable Indian
accents. :-) I've gotten a few samples from Chicago
electronic companies shipped from ALLIED stock, believe
it or not. Good service.

A great problem with some olde-tyme hammes is that NONE
of the biggie electronics parts distributors stock much
HF "radio" parts that they expect. The parts market just
isn't there any more. Real radio parts are involved at
frequencies higher than HF. Those are in abundance.
Anyone who wants old-style HF "radio" parts has to go
to smaller mail outlets such as Ocean State Electronics.
But, they will be shocked by the high prices charged,
not at all as low as when they were adolescents.

The same with "plate and filament" transformers. About
the only outlet in North America for stock parts is a
Hammond division up in Canada (distributed by Mouser
down here). Fine products I hear, but the cost is high.
Electronics parts are, and have been for decades,
oriented to lower-voltage semiconductor technology.
What was once a provence of ham radio builders is now
much much larger in favor of computer-digital
components. Vacuum tubes (from new, old stock), if you
can get them, now cost five times what they did in 1960
and go up from there. The old days are GONE. They
won't come back as they once were.

Now, as to Heil, he doesn't know his chain gets yanked
and his buttons pushed by me. :-) That's part of my
game whenever he puts on the Waffen SS persona and tells
me "you never did such a thing!" or puts on the little
red hat while dancing to organ-grinder Miccolis' tune on
"corrections." It is both funny and tragic that they
carry on like they do, but that's their way in here.
Shrug...I've seen worse on BBSs after first doing
computer-modem comms 22 years ago. Usually I just shine
them off but the chain-yanking and button-pushing urge
gets irresistable and off we go. Poor Heil doesn't
realize he's been controlled every time he tries to
control others! :-) Gotta love it...! :-)

Regards,

On Jan 29, 1:02�pm, Bob Brock wrote:
On Mon, 29 Jan 2007 12:52:16 -0500, "KH6HZ" wrote:
"Bob Brock" writes:

In response to "Dee Flint" :

Right. *Radio Shack pimps the hot products for the moment. The way I see
it, them not even carrying license manuals speaks volumes about demand for
them. *Now, when you walk into a Radio Shack and see loads of HF antennas,
HF rigs, and a shelf of study guides; then you can say that Ham radio is
back in demand.

Radio Shack cannot compete with big discount houses like HRO.

You must be going to the wrong Radio Shacks. *I saw stereos and TV's
all over the place when I went in.

But you didn't see computers, did you?

Once upon a time, RS was fairly big player in the consumer computer
market. But then they found it was too competitive a market, and they
could not compete with computer stores like CompUSA, MicroCenter,
etc. Now RS sells cables, adapters, disks, etc., but not computers.

*In theory, Radio Shack should be
in a much better position to sell ham equipment than HRO provided they
could sell it. *If you don't believe in economy of scale, look at
Wal-Mart and get back with me.

Right - and Wal-Mart doesn't sell ham gear.

The economy of scale situation in ham radio today is mail order/
internet sales, plus hamfest/conventions. because they're the most
competitive for most things. Some manufacturers sell don't sell
through dealers at all - Ten Tec and Elecraft are two examples.

In the bad old days, there were "radio parts stores" here in the
Philadelphia area. Plus we had mail order to Allied, Newark and
Lafayette. Today the parts stores are gone but the mail order is
bigger than ever: Allied and Newark are still around, plus Mouser and
Digi-Key.

btw, Digi-Key got its name because it started out as a tiny mailorder
business about 1968. They sold RTL logic chips to hams for Morse Code
keyers. QST, APril 1968. Then they added some popular transistors, and
sockets, and resistors....and the rest is history.

The radio parts stores existed, IMHO, because electronics weren't that
reliable back then - and they were expensive. TVs, radios, "hi-fis",
ham gear, etc., were usually fixed rather than discarded if they
stopped working, and those stores sold a steady stream of parts to
keep them working. There were also lots of hams and nonhams building
stuff from scratch to save money over buying, or to build things that
nobody manufactured.

All that has changed. Most consumer electronics is so reliable and
so inexpensive now that when it fails it is usually simply replaced.
Plus
the cost of labor often makes it uneconomical to fix a failed device.
In
fact, much of it is replaced *before* it fails. So the repair parts
business isn't what it was.

In most cases, you won't save money building electronic devices from
new parts *if* a similar item is manufactured by some company already,
because they get their parts in quantity and you don't. Any savings
come from using parts that are not bought new, and custom designs that
nobody manufactures.

The way to "sell" ham radio is simply to make it more visible to the
general public. The biggest barrier to that, IMHO, is anti-antenna
restrictions that are more common and more onerous every year.

How many of us first became aware of the existence of local amateurs
by seeing their antennas?

73 de Jim, N2EY