From: (Steve Robeson, K4CAP)

The photo of the club members homebrewing was taken before I joined the
club.
They have not done that activity since I have joined the club. That photo
is
still on the club page, as if thats what the club members are interested
in.

And YOU think that just because no one had taken the picture off
the webpage that that's ALL they do???

You're right. That's a reasonable explanation. Alot of times I have seen old
info stay on several websites. The same thing could have happened on their
webpage.

What I am willing to bet is that if Vippy takes someone to a
Hamfest, the third party is likely to say "What the heck are you
talking about...these are just good people having fun",

That's possible, but not probable. They will probably notice that its mostly
older males right away. Also, if I invite them on a Hamfest that continues to
Fri, Sat night, then I'll bet they will wonder why the Hams are operating
rather than doing what most people do. I know of a couple of Hamfests coming up
in late August. One of those had the Wouff Hong ceremony you had top wait three
hours for (no activities scheduled in between).

What would the non-Ham observer think of that?

that hams set out for an operating activity and then waste that time by
operating or you being under the impression that your travel to a
domestic location was a "DXpedition".

Comes to America then wonders why
America isn't like the place he left.

At a DXpedition, that's would most (non-Ham) Americans would expect in
(American) society.

Most (non-Ham) Americans would of course expect operating activities, but not
the whole day and night (with the only breaks for eating alot). Especially at a
vacation spot. A few weeks ago, at the club's cookout, one female person even
asked "Is operating all you did, you didn't go to the beach or anything?". I
doubt you'll see her at next year's event.

Most (non-Ham) Americans would expect the Hams would take a break from
operating on Sat night. They would be surprised and disappointed otherwise.

(Vshah101) wrote in message ...
From: (Steve Robeson, K4CAP)

And YOU think that just because no one had taken the picture off
the webpage that that's ALL they do???

You're right. That's a reasonable explanation. Alot of times I have seen old
info stay on several websites. The same thing could have happened on their
webpage.

In otherwords: "I can't provide a reasonable alternative".

What I am willing to bet is that if Vippy takes someone to a
Hamfest, the third party is likely to say "What the heck are you
talking about...these are just good people having fun",

That's possible, but not probable. (SNIP)

It's most likely, unless the third party you take is a relative
of yours.

They will probably notice that its mostly older males right away. )SNIP)

So are the Knights of Columbus, The Shriners, and a long list of
other social organizations I can think of...So what?

Also, if I invite them on a Hamfest that continues to
Fri, Sat night, then I'll bet they will wonder why the Hams are operating
rather than doing what most people do.

"..what most people do"...?!?!

It's ABOUT Amatuer Radio, Vipul...The event is organized FOR
Amateur Radio operators by Amateurs and OPERATING radios.

If you go to a NASCAR event, "most people" are watching or racing
fast cars. If you go to a rock concert, they are listening/watching a
band play music.

Why do you fail to comprehend that Amateur Radio is ABOUT
operating radios??? It's not about sightseeing, meeting preety fems,
or discussing dietary habits.

I know of a couple of Hamfests coming up
in late August. One of those had the Wouff Hong ceremony you had top wait three
hours for (no activities scheduled in between).

Well by golly why don't YOU go organize a sightseeing trip or get
Jenny Craig to come in and give a presentation...???

What would the non-Ham observer think of that?

What does it matter, Vipul? The event was not organized for "the
non-ham observer". It was organized for the licensed Amateur
participant.

that hams set out for an operating activity and then waste that time by
operating or you being under the impression that your travel to a
domestic location was a "DXpedition".

Comes to America then wonders why
America isn't like the place he left.

At a DXpedition, that's would most (non-Ham) Americans would expect in
(American) society.

It doesn't matter what a "non-ham" thinks about it, Vipul. If a
"non-ham" is looking for any of the aforementioned distractions, then
they are free to do them. Amateur Radio is ABOUT operating radios.

Most (non-Ham) Americans would of course expect operating activities, but not
the whole day and night (with the only breaks for eating alot). Especially at a
vacation spot. A few weeks ago, at the club's cookout, one female person even
asked "Is operating all you did, you didn't go to the beach or anything?". I
doubt you'll see her at next year's event.

Well that's too bad. You had better run along an catch her,
Vippy! You and her have something in common! A complete lack of
understanding of what the event is all about.

Most (non-Ham) Americans would expect the Hams would take a break from
operating on Sat night. They would be surprised and disappointed otherwise.

Why? Why should "they" expect Amateurs to stop doing the very
thing the special even was organized to do...?!?!

Sheesh

Steve, K4YZ

(Vshah101) wrote in message ...
From: (Steve Robeson, K4CAP)

I have seen old
info stay on several websites. The same thing could have happened on their
webpage.

In otherwords: "I can't provide a reasonable alternative".

I am sure I'm right about the club members hating homebrewing.

I am sure you have convinced yourself of this, however you have
not provided one iota of "evidence" other than your own tainted
opinion, Vipul.

This could be verified by asking people in the photo if they want to do a
homebrewing project. Many of the people in the photo are still in the club.

This could be verified by you identifying the club to us and
allowing third parties to do the asking.

However, I've let my club membership expire. And, tracking down people in the
photo would get very time consuming. Alot of work just to prove a point. Also,
I have other things that I need to do.

YOU said the picture is still on the club webpage. It will take
no more than a few minutes time to read the caption and make a couple
phone calls to either confirm or eliminate your suspicions. The only
thing between you and vindication is knowing the name of the club.

Also, if I invite them on a Hamfest that continues to
Fri, Sat night, then I'll bet they will wonder why the Hams are operating
rather than doing what most people do.

"..what most people do"...?!?!

It's ABOUT Amatuer Radio, Vipul...The event is organized FOR
Amateur Radio operators by Amateurs and OPERATING radios.

Other than Field day, an event does not HAVE do be scheduled during Fri, Sat
night. Most people would do more recreational activities during that time.

Vipul, the average American WORKS Monday through Friday with
Saturday and Sunday off. When would YOU schedule these "activities"?
Most club meetings (lasting 1-3 hours) ARE scheduled during the week,
sometimes with some pro-social activity included.

Its only because Hams are the type of people that would be at a Hamfest or
operate Sat night. My former co-worker, the Ham that introduced me to a
Hamfest, was fairly anti-social too. Also, he made weekly coffee trips to
Starbucks (alot of calories).

Well there you go...we'll blame the whole thing on too much
caffiene and too much calories.

He is now out of the country. He is American, and
he married some Asian girl he met online and he quit his job and moved over
there.

Lucky him.

What does it matter, Vipul? The event was not organized for "the
non-ham observer".

Sometimes they do try to sign up new members there. The anti-social aspect
would put off the person considering the hobby. That's a reason people turn
away.

WHAT "anti-social" aspect, Vipul? YOU call it "anti-social"
because you do not understand it or refuse to participate in it
because they are not doing it the way YOU think it should be
done...YOUR loss.

Most (non-Ham) Americans would expect the Hams would take a break from
operating on Sat night. They would be surprised and disappointed otherwise.

Why? Why should "they" expect Amateurs to stop doing the very
thing the special even was organized to do...?!?!

The event more than fulfilled what it was organized to do when they operated
all day with few breaks. It was not necessary to go all night as well. They
could have taken at least a few hours break to do some vacation activities.

So the other operators who work days and can only get on the
radio in the evenings should of been denied the chance to "work" this
station just because they had a day job? Foreign operators on the
other side of the world should have been denied the chance to make a
contact just becasue of thier location?

That's very bigoted, Vipul. VERY bigoted...AND selfish on YOUR
part. Your whole rant in this forum is based on your perceived
exclusion from certain actitives, yet YOU would do things to excluded
others from being able to participate in Amateur radio.

That's what most (non-Ham) people would do. Even another hobby group would take
a break from that hobby on Sat night and enjoy some of the vacation activities
at a vacation location. Its only Hams that would continue operating Sat night.
They saw other Hams on ATV, but not other people in person. I don't expect that
you would understand that most people would be disappointed with that.

This activity was organized and executed for a certain purpose,
Vippy...Activating that location for whatever program they were
participating it. It was not chosen for it's tourist highlights or to
satisfy "non-Hams" perceptions of what this is all about.

Furthermore, the very characteristics of HF operation generally
dictate better propagation and long-distance communication
opportunities at night.

Other than Amateur Astronomers, I can not think of any other
"hobby group" that does better at night than in the daytime.

THAT is something I don't expect YOU would understand. You don't
have the experience in Amateur Radio, and it's obvious YOU do not
understand propgation characteristics that dictate these needs. No
wonder you're no longer an "EE"...
(choking back laugh of Vippy having ever done ANY electrical
"engineering" work)

Steve, K4YZ

"Vshah101" wrote in message
...
From: (Steve Robeson, K4CAP)

I have seen old
info stay on several websites. The same thing could have happened on
their
webpage.

In otherwords: "I can't provide a reasonable alternative".

I am sure I'm right about the club members hating homebrewing.

This could be verified by asking people in the photo if they want to do a
homebrewing project. Many of the people in the photo are still in the
club.


Speculation is not evidence. If you haven't asked them, then there is NO
way you can know.

However, I've let my club membership expire. And, tracking down people in
the
photo would get very time consuming. Alot of work just to prove a point.
Also,
I have other things that I need to do.


If the point is important enough to you to keep repeating it in this
newsgroup then it is absolutely necessary for you to either PROVE the point
or SHUT UP.

Also, if I invite them on a Hamfest that continues to
Fri, Sat night, then I'll bet they will wonder why the Hams are
operating
rather than doing what most people do.

"..what most people do"...?!?!


And what do you think "most people" do? Everyone I know does something
different. No two people do the same thing. A lot of people simply stay
home because they aren't interested in spending their money on bars and
parties.

It's ABOUT Amatuer Radio, Vipul...The event is organized FOR
Amateur Radio operators by Amateurs and OPERATING radios.

Other than Field day, an event does not HAVE do be scheduled during Fri,
Sat
night. Most people would do more recreational activities during that time.


This is a recreational activity for hams. Besides that, this is only a few
weekends out of the year. There are 52 weekends per year. In the past 12
months, I've gone to 3 hamfests. This means that there were 49 other
weekends for other recreational activities.

Its only because Hams are the type of people that would be at a Hamfest or
operate Sat night. My former co-worker, the Ham that introduced me to a
Hamfest, was fairly anti-social too. Also, he made weekly coffee trips to
Starbucks (alot of calories). He is now out of the country. He is
American, and
he married some Asian girl he met online and he quit his job and moved
over
there.

What does it matter, Vipul? The event was not organized for "the
non-ham observer".

Sometimes they do try to sign up new members there. The anti-social aspect
would put off the person considering the hobby. That's a reason people
turn
away.


The non-ham who is being recruited needs to know what hams do. Therefore if
they are "put off" by the hamfest, it's quite possible that ham radio is not
the hobby for them just like it's not appropriate for you. We don't need
more people with licenses who are not active.


Most (non-Ham) Americans would expect the Hams would take a break from
operating on Sat night. They would be surprised and disappointed
otherwise.

Why? Why should "they" expect Amateurs to stop doing the very
thing the special even was organized to do...?!?!


Have you ever been to other major events in other hobbies? For example,
people participate in various vehicle rallies where all they do for two days
is cruise their vintage automobile up and down the designated streets.
Other than stopping to eat, they don't take a break to do "other things."

The event more than fulfilled what it was organized to do when they
operated
all day with few breaks. It was not necessary to go all night as well.
They
could have taken at least a few hours break to do some vacation
activities.

That's what most (non-Ham) people would do. Even another hobby group would
take
a break from that hobby on Sat night and enjoy some of the vacation
activities
at a vacation location. Its only Hams that would continue operating Sat
night.
They saw other Hams on ATV, but not other people in person. I don't expect
that
you would understand that most people would be disappointed with that.

The majority of other hams would not be disappointed in that. Besides that
most hams that I know are adults and if they decide to partake in other
activities at the site they do so. On Field Day, my husband spent several
hours at a nearby lake fishing as a break from hamming. He didn't need to
make other people go with him. He did what he wanted when he wanted to.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Phil wrote:


There are a surprising number of hams out there that have lost the
spirit of the hobby (one idiot told me that he won't bother to QSO
with someone who is off by even 10 Hz....it bothers his ears!)

That is what RIT is for, but these refugees from the cb band
don't know how to use it. They would really be hacked if they
had to operate in the days when Novices were required to be
crystal controlled. You called CQ on your crystal frequency then
had to tune the band with your receiver to listen for another
Novice, who more than likely had a different crystal frequency,
giving you a call. Too many modern day jap appliance operators
are wimps when it comes to operating, they know how to turn on
the rig, read their fancy digital readout and that is the height
of their technical skills.

"JJ" wrote in message
...


Phil wrote:


There are a surprising number of hams out there that have lost the
spirit of the hobby (one idiot told me that he won't bother to QSO
with someone who is off by even 10 Hz....it bothers his ears!)

That is what RIT is for, but these refugees from the cb band
don't know how to use it. They would really be hacked if they
had to operate in the days when Novices were required to be
crystal controlled. You called CQ on your crystal frequency then
had to tune the band with your receiver to listen for another
Novice, who more than likely had a different crystal frequency,
giving you a call. Too many modern day jap appliance operators
are wimps when it comes to operating, they know how to turn on
the rig, read their fancy digital readout and that is the height
of their technical skills.


Looks like 'JJ' has it right. He hit it right on the head. What Phil needs
to do is take the boatanchors to the AM group. THey at least know how to
tune a fella in. 3880/3885, 7190/95, 7160. 14280 or so. 28.1 and up.

Enjoy.

Dan/W4NTI

In article ,
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) writes:

Well, Phil...idiots are idiots, on or off the air.

Amy and I just moved to new digs and I'm QRT for the moment or
I'd set a sked with you. That older gear has a warmth and fullness
that this solid waste (I meant solid STATE) stuff can't match...at
least not yet.

Ah, progress?

I thought pSycho pSteve finally reached the 1970s level of the amateur
radio technical art...

No, he has aligned himself with the Anti-Semiconductor Movement.

"Real radios glow in the dark" and that sort of thing. "Warmth."

Or is he just technically constipated, therefore thinking about waste?

LHA

(Len Over 21) wrote in message ...

No, he has aligned himself with the Anti-Semiconductor Movement.

No, Your Putziness...Quality is quality whether it is the
fidelity of a tube-based radio or a well-aged wine.

"Real radios glow in the dark" and that sort of thing. "Warmth."

Embracing technology changes simply because it's a "change" does
not make it better...just different.

Or is he just technically constipated, therefore thinking about waste?

As witless as ever, I see.

Steve, K4YZ

Len,

Steve's point regarding older equipment does have considerable merit -
modern equipment was not designed to be tinkered with or repaired by
anyone without very complex equipment at their disposal. The tube era
(and transistorised solid state) equipment could easily be adapted and
experimented with by a reasonably skilled operator. In fact, I recall
that the initial intent of ham radio was to encourage people to
develop technical expertise in the radio art (I asked one ham to
switch his Icom rig to USB on 40 meters, so that I could check whether
I my audio roblem was limited to LSB - after around 5 minutes, he
confessed that he could not figure out how to do it! - so much for
technical skills...) As such, I don't see how this goal is being
accomplished by the current generation of 'set the dial and talk'
equipment. As such, I'd suggest that your observations regarding
Steve's position on current equipment is flawed. I certainly don't
care if the radio glows in the dark - but it would be refreshing to
meet more people who can apply basic radio theory to a simple QSO!

Steve, you are absolutely correct - idiots are idiots, on or off the
air. Or the internet, apparently.

Phil


snip

Well, Phil...idiots are idiots, on or off the air.

Amy and I just moved to new digs and I'm QRT for the moment or
I'd set a sked with you. That older gear has a warmth and fullness
that this solid waste (I meant solid STATE) stuff can't match...at
least not yet.

Ah, progress?

I thought pSycho pSteve finally reached the 1970s level of the amateur
radio technical art...

No, he has aligned himself with the Anti-Semiconductor Movement.

"Real radios glow in the dark" and that sort of thing. "Warmth."

Or is he just technically constipated, therefore thinking about waste?

LHA

(Len Over 21) wrote in message ...
In article ,
(Steve Robeson, K4CAP) writes:

(Len Over 21) wrote in message
...

No, he has aligned himself with the Anti-Semiconductor Movement.

No, Your Putziness...Quality is quality whether it is the
fidelity of a tube-based radio or a well-aged wine.

Take your medications, pSycho pSteve. You are still in fantasies.

The "fidelity of a TUBE-based radio" is a myth, a fantasy, and
probably concocted by other ignorant radio piddlers who want
to apply supernatural "magic" to something they aren't able to
comprehend.

In as much as you are not practiced in Amateur Radio techniques
no one would expect you to know the difference.

There IS a diffrence.

"Real radios glow in the dark" and that sort of thing. "Warmth."

Embracing technology changes simply because it's a "change" does
not make it better...just different.

The solid-state era began in industry about 1960. That's 43 years ago.

Radio AMATEURS didn't really discover it until about two decades
later. Still, that's 23 years ago.

Actually that would be over 40 years ago as Heathkit had already
incorporated hybrid technology in the mid sixties.

(What a lame try, Lennie...You really DO have to try harder!)

Hardly a recently changed technology.

Hardly any effort to poke holes in your anti-Amateur Radio rants.

TRY TO REMEMBER TO TAKE YOUR MEDICATIONS!

Try a better obfuscation, Lennie. You're getting just too easy
to make an idiot out of...Again.

Steve, K4YZ