In article , Alun
writes:

"Kim W5TIT" wrote in
:

"Bert Craig" wrote in message
news
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
gy.com...

"Alun" wrote in message
...
It just so happens that I don't
like CW, in the sense of I have no desire to use it. That should
be OK too, but for some reason it bothers you. Why?

No it does not bother me that someone who has learned it chooses not
to use it. They have made that decision from a position of
knowledge and experience. This is radically different from a person
judging it and saying they will never use it when they do not have
that knowledge and experience to draw on.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Right on the money, Dee. Larry pointed this out earlier, but not as
eloquently as you.

73 de Bert
WA2SI

It fascinates me that you won't accept someone's plain and simple truth
that they don't like CW--even if they don't have experience with
it--because you reason that they need to have "knowledge and
experience" with it. Well, I know people who are quite well-versed in
CW who don't like it, people who haven't ever even tried it and don't
like it, and people who have taken and passed a 5wpm test and don't
like it. I also know people from those same three categories that do
like CW operation.

It's pretty much as simple as folks who do or don't like most other
things in life. Either ya like it or ya don't.

Kim W5TIT

I think that you have hit upon a very important point there, Kim. A good
analogy might be not liking an item of food that you haven't tried,
because it looks disgusting on your plate. If you eat some you might like
it, or not, but there are probably all kinds of other things that contain
the same nutrition. These guys are like a parent telling a child that they
have to eat their brocolli. But they aren't my parents and I don't like
brocolli, or CW. I take vitamins, and work phone.

Excellent analogy, Kim and Alun!

[...shades of "Mommie Dearest" I used some months ago... :-) ]

Morse code is 159 years old. It was first used in COMMERCIAL
messaging back in 1844. It has quite a lot of history of use to base
an effectiveness of communications. That base and history is why
morse code is only used in amateur radio today. All the commercial
and military users have dropped morse code use in the rest of the
radio world. Morse just isn't as effective as its believers think.

Dee insists that "enlightened" folks "have to experience something"
before stating an opinion on it.

Okay, so all the obstetricians have to be female and parents before
being allowed to supervise birthing? All gynecologists have to be
female in order to treat women patients? Same logic.

Catholic priests will have to have been married at one time in order to
advise engaged couples about to marry. Military people will have to
go out and engage in combat, killing someone FIRST before they can
state an "enlightened" opinion on war. Absolutely NO ONE can voice
any "enlightened" opinion on politics, foreign policy, economics, or
homosexuality unless they have DONE any of those things... :-)

Absolutely nothing NEW can be done because no one has any
experience in doing it. The ONLY way to stay "enlightened" is to
remain in status quo forever. :-)

Was Thomas Edison "enlightened?" :-)

Some of these pro-coders are a little too enlighted in the head.

LHA

"Alun" wrote

It would be a better plan to make the limit 100W, i.e. base it on the
equipment, not vicea versa.

That's a 'novel' idea! In that case the power limit should be 2.5KW,
because that's how much output my homebrew linear will produce if I supply
enough drive. If I build an even bigger linear, will FCC raise my power
limit? (Or will they expect me to obey the regulations?)

And we should make the speed limits in my town 140MPH, because that's how
fast my supercharged Ssei will run. (Try that one in front of the judge!)

Sunuvagun!

73, de Hans, K0HB

"Alun" wrote in message
...
"Bert Craig" wrote in
et:


"Alun" wrote in message
...
What is annoying is that a skill test is foisted on those who don't
have the desire to use the skill.

Alan, I'm gonna let you in on a secret...although I know that you're
already aware of it. Preparing for and passing the 5-wpm Elemnt 1 test
does NOT leave one ready to use the skill OTA. It only gives one a
taste so that one may make an educated choice as to whether or not they
wish to persue CW any further.


5 wpm is certainly too slow to prove much, but it only still exists at
that level as a residual requirement to meet the old s25.5, which has
since been changed so that no code test is required atall. If the FCC
truly thought that a CW test was necessary, the speed would be higher.

Agreed, I was pointing out a very beneficial secondary benefit. It
"requires" one to place themselves in a position from which to make an
educated decision.

As I mentioned in another post, the mode is really not the issue...the
having to really learn it is. Do away with the published Q&A pools and
watch the whining escalate.

Well, I think that the real issue is that it's a different kind of test.

Exactly.

Also, if
I hear CW on my frequency I may be able to read it with some
difficulty, but if I hear RTTY or PSK31 there is no chance.

You may have just touched on a selling point for CW.

73 de Bert
WA2SI

Whilst that is true, the point I was making is actually that since I can't
read RTTY or PSK by ear, and they are legal modes, it doesn't help all
that much that I can read CW (albeit not terribly well, since I never use
it).

73 de Alun, N3KIP

I understand the point you were making. If I could just ask you why you
bothered to take the code test(s)?

73 de Bert
WA2SI

"Alun" wrote in message
...
"Kim W5TIT" wrote in
:

"Bert Craig" wrote in message
news
"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
gy.com...

"Alun" wrote in message
...
It just so happens that I don't
like CW, in the sense of I have no desire to use it. That should
be OK too, but for some reason it bothers you. Why?

No it does not bother me that someone who has learned it chooses not
to use it. They have made that decision from a position of
knowledge and experience. This is radically different from a person
judging it and saying they will never use it when they do not have
that knowledge and experience to draw on.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

Right on the money, Dee. Larry pointed this out earlier, but not as
eloquently as you.

73 de Bert
WA2SI



It fascinates me that you won't accept someone's plain and simple truth
that they don't like CW--even if they don't have experience with
it--because you reason that they need to have "knowledge and
experience" with it. Well, I know people who are quite well-versed in
CW who don't like it, people who haven't ever even tried it and don't
like it, and people who have taken and passed a 5wpm test and don't
like it. I also know people from those same three categories that do
like CW operation.

It's pretty much as simple as folks who do or don't like most other
things in life. Either ya like it or ya don't.

Kim W5TIT




I think that you have hit upon a very important point there, Kim. A good
analogy might be not liking an item of food that you haven't tried,
because it looks disgusting on your plate. If you eat some you might like
it, or not, but there are probably all kinds of other things that contain
the same nutrition. These guys are like a parent telling a child that they
have to eat their brocolli. But they aren't my parents and I don't like
brocolli, or CW. I take vitamins, and work phone.

Slight difference, Alun. Nobody's forcing anybody to learn code. There
exists a no-code Technician license for those who do not wish to have to
pass the 5-wpm code exam.

73 de Bert
WA2SI

In article , "Bert Craig"
writes:

Slight difference, Alun. Nobody's forcing anybody to learn code. There
exists a no-code Technician license for those who do not wish to have to
pass the 5-wpm code exam.

Slight difference, Egbert. Nobody's forcing you to ride in the front
of the bus. Get back in the back, all you heretic infidels who don't
love morse!

You have any more "enlightened" reasoning to offer?

LHA

In article . net, "KØHB"
writes:

And we should make the speed limits in my town 140MPH, because that's how
fast my supercharged Ssei will run.

Your speed is too slow for Daytona. Get more supercharging..

LHA

"Mike Coslo" wrote'

But for years now, the standard max power for
most HF rigs has been 100 watts.

In Japan, where there is a 10W power limit on one class of HF operators,
there is a plethora of 10W rigs available, most exactly the same as their
100W cousins except with a 10W final stage. As an example, the Icom 760
which is identical to the Icom 761 except it runs 10W. If the regulations
created a market for 50W-max HF radios, they'd be on the shelves of HRO in
time for Christmas giving.

73, de Hans, K0HB

KØHB wrote:

"Alun" wrote


It would be a better plan to make the limit 100W, i.e. base it on the
equipment, not vicea versa.


That's a 'novel' idea! In that case the power limit should be 2.5KW,
because that's how much output my homebrew linear will produce if I supply
enough drive. If I build an even bigger linear, will FCC raise my power
limit? (Or will they expect me to obey the regulations?)

And we should make the speed limits in my town 140MPH, because that's how
fast my supercharged Ssei will run. (Try that one in front of the judge!)

Are you seriously suggesting this is an appropriate reply to what Alun
wrote?

1. Who cares what your homebrew amp can run? You or I can make a larger
amp than that. You are arguing past people like Alun and myself. The
argument isn't about how much smoke any one person can put on the air.
The argument is about making a power limit that is accomodating of the
way that equipment has been made for quite a while and is still made
today. In fact if you were to call for a power limit of 100 watts, I
would say "that's fine."

2. I've been waiting for someone to bring up the automobile power
thing. That argument is completely irrelevant to this discussion. If
automobiles were made that could only go the speed limit and no more,
then they would have very little power. If ham transcievers were
comparable in any way to cars, we would have to start our transmissiona
at a high rate of power, and reduce power as we get up to whatever it is
we would have to get up to. The two just aren't related.

- Mike KB3EIA -

"Mike Coslo" wrote

Are you seriously suggesting this is an appropriate reply to what Alun
wrote?

Yes.

73, de Hans, K0HB

KØHB wrote:

"Mike Coslo" wrote


Are you seriously suggesting this is an appropriate reply to what Alun
wrote?


Yes.

That says quite a lot.

- Mike KB3EIA -