HF spectrum anyway. So much for secure connections. Now do you all
understand what is REALLY going on?

Dan/W4NTI

You betcha, though it's ironic how few Americans in this "well informed"
environment have any inkling as to what's actually happening in this good
'ole USofA. Reliable news feeds are available and anyone can look, but it's
remarkable how few people can connect the dots. History is repeating itself.
Problem is, it's only been 50 years since the fall of the Reich; way too
short a time for an encore, but here we are.

Read and be educated, folks...

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/index.html

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/

http://www.truthout.com/





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"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
...

The universal access with multiple choices means very heavy investment as
now that could be construed to mean that BPL, DSL, cable, and WI-FI all
need
set up in our rural areas to provide those choices. Guess what! Ain't
gonna happen.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Dee, correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't there available direct satellite
internet available? As long as one has an unobstructed view to the
Southwestern sky? (I subscribe to Direct TV - but use DSL as it only costs
me $29.95 per month). I think it runs $49.95 per month (the same as DSL
costs in Sun City, Florida). As far as broadband over powerline, we all
know it isn't going to happen in rural areas. I'm really curious about
those broadcasters with deep pockets and what will happen to channel 2 and 3
television. Of course, analog tv is on its' way out which will probably
save BPLs real quick demise .... maybe.

73 from Rochester, NY
Jim AA2QA



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"Jim Hampton" wrote in message
...

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
...

The universal access with multiple choices means very heavy investment
as
now that could be construed to mean that BPL, DSL, cable, and WI-FI all
need
set up in our rural areas to provide those choices. Guess what! Ain't
gonna happen.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Dee, correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't there available direct satellite
internet available? As long as one has an unobstructed view to the
Southwestern sky? (I subscribe to Direct TV - but use DSL as it only
costs
me $29.95 per month). I think it runs $49.95 per month (the same as DSL
costs in Sun City, Florida). As far as broadband over powerline, we all
know it isn't going to happen in rural areas. I'm really curious about
those broadcasters with deep pockets and what will happen to channel 2 and
3
television. Of course, analog tv is on its' way out which will probably
save BPLs real quick demise .... maybe.

73 from Rochester, NY
Jim AA2QA


I imagine it is available in some areas. However I was attempting to make
the point that it will not be economically feasible to provide the same wide
variety of choices to a rural area as a metropolitan area. A rural area
will be more limited in the internet access choices to pick from.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in
:


"Jim Hampton" wrote in message
...

"Dee D. Flint" wrote in message
...

The universal access with multiple choices means very heavy
investment as now that could be construed to mean that BPL, DSL,
cable, and WI-FI all need set up in our rural areas to provide those
choices. Guess what! Ain't gonna happen.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE


Dee, correct me if I'm wrong. Isn't there available direct satellite
internet available? As long as one has an unobstructed view to the
Southwestern sky? (I subscribe to Direct TV - but use DSL as it only
costs me $29.95 per month). I think it runs $49.95 per month (the
same as DSL costs in Sun City, Florida). As far as broadband over
powerline, we all know it isn't going to happen in rural areas. I'm
really curious about those broadcasters with deep pockets and what
will happen to channel 2 and 3 television. Of course, analog tv is on
its' way out which will probably save BPLs real quick demise ....
maybe.

73 from Rochester, NY
Jim AA2QA


I imagine it is available in some areas. However I was attempting to
make the point that it will not be economically feasible to provide the
same wide variety of choices to a rural area as a metropolitan area. A
rural area will be more limited in the internet access choices to pick
from.

Dee D. Flint, N8UZE



The cheapest satellite Internet access in the US is Starband, which is
$40/mo for 768k speed. However, the combined cost of equipment and setup is
$600!!! This is why I still have dialup, no other broadband being
available. It is possible to find the equipment used (some people sell it
when they get DSL or cable in their area), but the setup fee is still $240.
That's not a typo, it's $240 for setup, not $24.

In my case I think both DSL and cable are available on the other side of
the street! One friend suggested I should get Wi-Fi and link into one of my
neighbours, paying a cut towards their broadband bill. He knows someone
who linked their house with their business premises by Wi-Fi, but says they
lose the connection when it rains!

BPL is set to cost only about as much as DSL and maybe nothing to install.
Some people would go for it just because they don't have a spare 600 bucks
to buy and set up a satellite system. I would almost be tempted if it
wasn't for ham radio. Cable Internet is $55/mo here. That includes $15/mo
for basic cable TV, whether you want it or not. DSL is $35/mo. I am sure
that some people would try BPL instead, as it doesn't need extra wires or
Wi-Fi.

73 de Alun, N3KIP

In article , Alun
writes:

The cheapest satellite Internet access in the US is Starband, which is
$40/mo for 768k speed. However, the combined cost of equipment and setup is
$600!!! This is why I still have dialup, no other broadband being
available. It is possible to find the equipment used (some people sell it
when they get DSL or cable in their area), but the setup fee is still $240.
That's not a typo, it's $240 for setup, not $24.

When DSL first appeared, there were substantial setup and equipment fees. They
have pretty much gone by the wayside now.

In my case I think both DSL and cable are available on the other side of
the street!

?? How wide is your street?

Or do your utilities run behind the houses, as they do here?

One friend suggested I should get Wi-Fi and link into one of my
neighbours, paying a cut towards their broadband bill. He knows someone
who linked their house with their business premises by Wi-Fi, but says they
lose the connection when it rains!

Lot of new 802.11() systems that are a lot more robust than earlier ones.

BPL is set to cost only about as much as DSL and maybe nothing to install.
Some people would go for it just because they don't have a spare 600 bucks
to buy and set up a satellite system. I would almost be tempted if it
wasn't for ham radio. Cable Internet is $55/mo here. That includes $15/mo
for basic cable TV, whether you want it or not. DSL is $35/mo. I am sure
that some people would try BPL instead, as it doesn't need extra wires or
Wi-Fi.

Some form of special modem is needed for BPL, and it is proprietary to the
particular system in use because they're all different. Your cable modem and
DSL prices are higher than we pay here ($43 and $30, respectively) and the
prices keep dropping. Verizon, for one, offers package deals where POTS, DSL
and cell phone service are all bundled together for a very reasonable price.

There are some new BPL articles on the ARRL website. Worth a read.

73 de Jim, N2EY

In article , PAMNO
(N2EY) writes:

In article , Alun
writes:

The cheapest satellite Internet access in the US is Starband, which is
$40/mo for 768k speed. However, the combined cost of equipment and setup is
$600!!! This is why I still have dialup, no other broadband being
available. It is possible to find the equipment used (some people sell it
when they get DSL or cable in their area), but the setup fee is still $240.
That's not a typo, it's $240 for setup, not $24.

When DSL first appeared, there were substantial setup and equipment fees.
They
have pretty much gone by the wayside now.

In my case I think both DSL and cable are available on the other side of
the street!

?? How wide is your street?

Or do your utilities run behind the houses, as they do here?

One friend suggested I should get Wi-Fi and link into one of my
neighbours, paying a cut towards their broadband bill. He knows someone
who linked their house with their business premises by Wi-Fi, but says they
lose the connection when it rains!

Lot of new 802.11() systems that are a lot more robust than earlier ones.

IEEE 802.15 and IEEE 802.16 standards are for metropolitan
systems using wireless access.

Complete specifications are available to the public for download
at no charge.

The colloquial term "Wi-Fi" is for wired systems using other IEEE
802 standards.

LHA / WMD

(Len Over 21) wrote in
:

In article ,
PAMNO (N2EY) writes:

In article , Alun
writes:

The cheapest satellite Internet access in the US is Starband, which is
$40/mo for 768k speed. However, the combined cost of equipment and
setup is $600!!! This is why I still have dialup, no other broadband
being available. It is possible to find the equipment used (some
people sell it when they get DSL or cable in their area), but the
setup fee is still $240. That's not a typo, it's $240 for setup, not
$24.

When DSL first appeared, there were substantial setup and equipment
fees. They
have pretty much gone by the wayside now.

In my case I think both DSL and cable are available on the other side
of the street!

?? How wide is your street?

Or do your utilities run behind the houses, as they do here?

One friend suggested I should get Wi-Fi and link into one of my
neighbours, paying a cut towards their broadband bill. He knows
someone who linked their house with their business premises by Wi-Fi,
but says they lose the connection when it rains!

Lot of new 802.11() systems that are a lot more robust than earlier
ones.

IEEE 802.15 and IEEE 802.16 standards are for metropolitan
systems using wireless access.

Complete specifications are available to the public for download
at no charge.

The colloquial term "Wi-Fi" is for wired systems using other IEEE
802 standards.

LHA / WMD


The point is do something cheaper than the satellite. Anything really
intended to work a block away probably wouldn't be.

PAMNO (N2EY) wrote in
:

In article , Alun
writes:

The cheapest satellite Internet access in the US is Starband, which is
$40/mo for 768k speed. However, the combined cost of equipment and
setup is $600!!! This is why I still have dialup, no other broadband
being available. It is possible to find the equipment used (some people
sell it when they get DSL or cable in their area), but the setup fee is
still $240. That's not a typo, it's $240 for setup, not $24.

When DSL first appeared, there were substantial setup and equipment
fees. They have pretty much gone by the wayside now.

True enough. Maybe this will happen with satellite eventually. We may just
have to wait.


In my case I think both DSL and cable are available on the other side
of the street!

?? How wide is your street?

It's a main road, but not a divided highway. It's not particularly wide.
The houses on the other side have their back yards facing the main road and
they are in subdivisions. We are not in a subdivision and have no
neighbours. If we were, then we would have an antenna covenant! That is the
supreme irony, if we were across the road and could get broadband I
couldn't put up antennas. I think dial-up and antennas is the better
choice.


Or do your utilities run behind the houses, as they do here?

The power lines run across my front yard, as does the cable from the cable
company. However, they wouldn't let the previous owner of this house have
cable TV service, saying that it is a main transmission cable not a
distribution cable! OTOH, the power lines are close enough that BPL is a
real worry. Still, they will be Part 15, so as a licenced user I will be
able to get them to shut their whole system down, right?


One friend suggested I should get Wi-Fi and link into one of my
neighbours, paying a cut towards their broadband bill. He knows
someone who linked their house with their business premises by Wi-Fi,
but says they lose the connection when it rains!

Lot of new 802.11() systems that are a lot more robust than earlier
ones.

BPL is set to cost only about as much as DSL and maybe nothing to
install. Some people would go for it just because they don't have a
spare 600 bucks to buy and set up a satellite system. I would almost be
tempted if it wasn't for ham radio. Cable Internet is $55/mo here. That
includes $15/mo for basic cable TV, whether you want it or not. DSL is
$35/mo. I am sure that some people would try BPL instead, as it doesn't
need extra wires or Wi-Fi.

Some form of special modem is needed for BPL, and it is proprietary to
the particular system in use because they're all different. Your cable
modem and DSL prices are higher than we pay here ($43 and $30,
respectively) and the prices keep dropping. Verizon, for one, offers
package deals where POTS, DSL and cell phone service are all bundled
together for a very reasonable price.


We have Verizon here too. I don't think they charge everyone the same
prices, though.

There are some new BPL articles on the ARRL website. Worth a read.

73 de Jim, N2EY



73 de Alun, N3KIP

In article , Alun
writes:

(N2EY) wrote in
:

In article , Alun
writes:

The cheapest satellite Internet access in the US is Starband, which is
$40/mo for 768k speed. However, the combined cost of equipment and
setup is $600!!! This is why I still have dialup, no other broadband
being available. It is possible to find the equipment used (some people
sell it when they get DSL or cable in their area), but the setup fee is
still $240. That's not a typo, it's $240 for setup, not $24.

When DSL first appeared, there were substantial setup and equipment
fees. They have pretty much gone by the wayside now.

True enough. Maybe this will happen with satellite eventually. We may just
have to wait.

Or pay the $$ up front.

In my case I think both DSL and cable are available on the other side
of the street!

?? How wide is your street?

It's a main road, but not a divided highway. It's not particularly wide.
The houses on the other side have their back yards facing the main road and
they are in subdivisions. We are not in a subdivision and have no
neighbours. If we were, then we would have an antenna covenant! That is the
supreme irony, if we were across the road and could get broadband I
couldn't put up antennas. I think dial-up and antennas is the better
choice.

Me too!

The main probelm with DSL is that the total cable length from your modem to the
telco's end is limited, and if you're too far away you cannot be served. Of
course they're building more infrastructure but that takes time and is focused
on the densest markets.

Or do your utilities run behind the houses, as they do here?

The power lines run across my front yard, as does the cable from the cable
company. However, they wouldn't let the previous owner of this house have
cable TV service, saying that it is a main transmission cable not a
distribution cable!

That may actually be true.

OTOH, the power lines are close enough that BPL is a
real worry. Still, they will be Part 15, so as a licenced user I will be
able to get them to shut their whole system down, right?

That's what Mr. P says...

One friend suggested I should get Wi-Fi and link into one of my
neighbours, paying a cut towards their broadband bill. He knows
someone who linked their house with their business premises by Wi-Fi,
but says they lose the connection when it rains!

Lot of new 802.11() systems that are a lot more robust than earlier
ones.

BPL is set to cost only about as much as DSL and maybe nothing to
install. Some people would go for it just because they don't have a
spare 600 bucks to buy and set up a satellite system. I would almost be
tempted if it wasn't for ham radio. Cable Internet is $55/mo here. That
includes $15/mo for basic cable TV, whether you want it or not. DSL is
$35/mo. I am sure that some people would try BPL instead, as it doesn't
need extra wires or Wi-Fi.

Some form of special modem is needed for BPL, and it is proprietary to
the particular system in use because they're all different. Your cable
modem and DSL prices are higher than we pay here ($43 and $30,
respectively) and the prices keep dropping. Verizon, for one, offers
package deals where POTS, DSL and cell phone service are all bundled
together for a very reasonable price.

We have Verizon here too. I don't think they charge everyone the same
prices, though.

The prices quoted are for the Philadelphia metro area.

There are some new BPL articles on the ARRL website. Worth a read.

73 de Jim, N2EY

In article , Alun
writes:

IEEE 802.15 and IEEE 802.16 standards are for metropolitan
systems using wireless access.

Complete specifications are available to the public for download
at no charge.

The colloquial term "Wi-Fi" is for wired systems using other IEEE
802 standards.

LHA / WMD

The point is do something cheaper than the satellite. Anything really
intended to work a block away probably wouldn't be.

One of the higher decimal number IEEE 802 Standards is for up
to 30 miles range. That might be a "Texas block" to some, but
most cities aren't 30 miles across. :-)

I have some of those 802 Standards but I'm not going to bother
with looking up any details for the regulars in here. Those (nearly
all PCTAs) will just tell me to go to the ARRL website for "a good
read." :-)

If you want the link to free IEEE 802 standards downloads, send
me e-mail.

LHA / WMD