In article , says...

I pay sticker for gasoline and electric power too.

Dave K8MN


I don't pay sticker for electric. In the empire of NY you can negoiate a price with your
electric vendor of choice. Not that it saves alot of money for me.

On Sat, 10 Jul 2004 21:44:11 GMT, Steve Stone wrote:

I don't pay sticker for electric. In the empire of NY you can
negoiate a price with your electric vendor of choice. Not that it
saves alot of money for me.

Out here in Greenie-land one has the choice of several "green"
sources, all at a higher price than "mutt" (mixed) power. I can't
even get what I really want -- in the Umpire State can one
negotiate a residential contract for guaranteed-all-nuclear-generated
power?

I suppose that if my consumption was 1000 MW (one standard
generating unit) I could negotiate same...assuming that they had a
spare unit sitting around offline or they could get the permits and
insurance to build another one (fat chance of that).

--
73 de K2ASP - Phil Kane

From a Clearing in the Silicon Forest
Beaverton (Washington County) Oregon

In article , Steve Stone
writes:

In article , says...

I pay sticker for gasoline and electric power too.

Dave K8MN


I don't pay sticker for electric. In the empire of NY you can negoiate a
price with your
electric vendor of choice. Not that it saves alot of money for me.

Negotiate?

Or do you simply have a choice of providers?

Here in EPA we can choose providers, all of whom have different rate plans. But
there's no negotiation - you pay what the rate plan says.

Is New York different?

73 de Jim, N2EY

In article , "Kim"
writes:

It will be a truly deregulated market when a REP provides "block pricing"
for entire neighborhoods. The more neighbors/streets/blocks that want to be
involved, the better the price. No reason residential markets shouldn't be
able to negotiate price--it just hasn't been done yet (well, at least that I
know of).

That'd be a hoot, Kim! Imagine trying to get a bunch of neighbors to agree on
something like that. Maybe in those McMansion-CC&Rs-out-the-wazoo communities,
tho...

The big joke about all this is that we really don't choose who actually
generates "our" electricity. It's more of a shares type of thing.

And after the mess out on the Left Coast a few summers ago, and now the
revelations of Enron double-dealing, the idea of highly regulated monopoly
utilities looks better and better, in some ways.....

Which reminds me - how come we can't buy group auto insurance?

73 de Jim, N2EY

Steve Stone wrote:

In article , says...

I pay sticker for gasoline and electric power too.

Dave K8MN


I don't pay sticker for electric. In the empire of NY you can negoiate a price with your
electric vendor of choice. Not that it saves alot of money for me.

Buying something from someone else isn't the same as negotiating a
price.
You're simply paying someone else's sticker price. You aren't haggling
with an electric company; you're changing providers.

Dave K8MN

Report On A Local Hamfest

After more than 5 years away from the hamfest scene, I went to the Kimberton,
PA (MARC) hamfest this morning. Last time I was there was 6-7 years ago.

Weather was great - clear and sunny but not humid or hot. Brought a van full of
stuff (mostly parts and ham magazines) to sell and sold a good amount. As is
usual, there was no good way of predicting what would sell and what wouldn't.

Attendance was about the same as I remember from 6-7 years ago. Kimberton is
not a big hamfest, and is not dominated by dealers or computer stuff. Prices
were what I consider reasonable for what was offered. Saw some old friends and
made some new ones. Said "good morning" or "hello" to everyone who visited my
table, and always got a pleasant response. Had some great conversations, too.
No griping, no nasties, no problems.

Main problem with hamfesting (for me) compared to internet selling is the time
investment. Have to spend some hours getting the sell stuff ready, loading the
car, driving there, selling, then loading up what didn't sell and reversing the
process. The time is in big chunks rather than a few minutes here and there If
the weather doesn't cooperate the effort is wasted. Internet prices are
generally higher but you have the packing and shipping work to do.

Now to check when the next 'fest is...

73 de Jim, N2EY

"LA Runabout" wrote in message
...
Often heard comments from hams attending a hamfest:

Where are all the dealers?

1) Most are Out of Business from lack of sales and/or were fed up with
putting up with
exceedingly cheap, dirty minded, odiferous old men. Also the complete
looneys
with the ball-mount antennas on their hard hats, which they used to see
at
each and every hamfest, year after year after year, who last parted
with a
$5 Bill when Jimmy Carter was President.

2) Their now on e-Bay where you can make big $$$ selling
40+ year old tube radios to complete suckers. (errr..radio
collectors)

3) Gave up long ago when they saw the writing-on-the-wall
with 65+ yo hams who still chain smoked and drank
like fish at the VFW or AL Hall and were 2 steps
from the graveyard.

4) Kids have abandoned ham radio a VERY long ago.
Oh sure, some ham's kid will be brow-beaten to get his
to get his license just so the old man can look
good at the club meeting, but sure as glub made
green apples, when the kid (uaually male and white)
turns 13 or 14 and the hormones kick-in, ham radio
goes away and in comes girls and Internet Chat rooms
and music swapping. (Hint: Put a teenager of 2004 in
front of a table with an FT-1000MP on one side and
and Apple Ipod with all accessories on the other and
tell him he can take his choice what he wants. Guess
what electronic goodie will win out in 98.9% of the time
with today's teenagers..?)

How come there are way less dealers this year?

See the above. (Plus it makes VERY GOOD FINANCIAL
SENSE to keep a listing of the hams in your area. When they
finally croak, and this is a sure bet per reason #3 above.)

In most cases their XYL's can't stand their ham radio, their male
ham friends and those goddammed antennas in the back yard !
Keep a list. When the Ham's name is in the Obit Listing in the
newspaper, be ready to pay a visit on successive trash nights
when she may put her dead hubby's radios out on the curb
or sells the radios for peanuts at the springtime yard sale.
Also place a call and offer to clean out all that radio crap a
few weeks after he's planted in Terra Firma! You may strike
a bargain like I did once and pick up pair of TS-850's for
$100.00 - (later re-sold on E-Sucker at considerable profit)

Why don't dealers come to hamfests anymore?

Most of em are too damm old and can't walk up
a flight of stairs at home, let alone a flea market.
Comes from years of smoking cancer-sticks or
smelly pipes. Watch'em drop in QST each month.
(Wayne Green was 100% right on this tobacco issue)

Often heard comments from hams at a hamfest when speaking
to a dealer at a hamfest:

Hey, how come youze guys dont have special hamfest prices?
Your prices are way too high.
Will you take a $100 less for this rig, since we're at a hamfest?
When are youze guys going to bring rigs to hamfests that people
wanna buy?
You guys stink, I can do better through your competitor's catalog.
This rig is scratched, will you take $250 off the marked price?
Hey, tell me about this new rig (takes up 35 mins of salesman's time,
then walks away saying he can get it for less.)

QSL and 10-4 on EVERYTHING you said above.
I've seen and heard it hundreds of time.

Comment Dealer makes when asked by hamfest committee
to set up at a hamfest:
Not worth my time or the expense.

Roger-Roger-Roger! Somebody buy that man a beer! : )

KU2S wrote:

Besides... If we wanted to pay retail, we'd just go mail order.
Hamfests are where one goes to look for a bargain.


And that simple fact is lost on so many people.

And sellers... don't forget supply and demand. If you don't sell
anything, you won't make anything, and maybe that's another reason why
some people drop out.




- Mike KB3EIA -

Steve Robeson K4CAP wrote:
Subject: Hams Gripe At Hamfests
From: KU2S
Date: 7/9/2004 10:27 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:


Besides... If we wanted to pay retail, we'd just go mail order.
Hamfests are where one goes to look for a bargain.


Not me!...I go to check out the hot babes!

(gurglegurglechokechoke ! ! ! !)


I've actually *seen* some at the last several I've gone to! Real ones,
not the "2:00 am in the bar" babes.... hehe


- Mike KB3EIA -

N2EY wrote:
In article , Dave Heil
writes:


Try walking into a Kroger store and saying, "I'll give you $3.50 for
this pork roast and that's my final offer."

I pay sticker for gasoline and electric power too.


Always wondered why most new consumer goods, from a head of lettuce to the big
ticket items like wide screen TVs, are "price as marked", but a few things like
cars are all about haggling. Except Saturns.

I've had good luck at hamfests by:

- Marking "asking" price on items so people have an idea what I think it's
worth.
- Marking "firm" if the price is not negotiable
- Offering stuff I just want to move as "name your price" or "make offer"

That's the way to do it! Somehow I suspect you don't hate the customer
either, eh?


Of course eBay and the 'net have had a big effect on 'fests. We've essentially
got a worldwide 24/7 hamfest going on, either as an auction or outright sale.
Plus you can toss out "wanted to buy" posts. Only downside is you're dealing at
a distance and the whole packing/shipping/payment/insurance headache.

And getting robbed one way or the other.


Why folks expect to get eBay prices at a hamfest is beyond me, though. If you
want eBay prices, go to eBay.


The bloom is fading from that rose anyway. I did a quick perusal of ham
related equipment, and the prices seemed quite similar to what I would
expect to pay at a flea. There will always be the occasional outrageous
selling price, either on the high or low end, but it looks as if sanity
may be coming home in Ebay.

- Mike KB3EIA -