N2EY wrote:
In article , "KØHB"
writes:


"Jim Hampton" wrote


C'mon, you know better than that. Perhaps the point is that equipment
sold in the United States is *supposed* to be (and likely was) checked
for radiated emissions.

Of course I know better than that!

And so does Jim.

A single example of this product developed some sort of birdie/spur on
121.5. Nothing more, nothing less.


If it happened once, it can happen again. We don't really know what made it
fail that way.


Of course the story makes good news copy on a slow day, but it's hardly
a remarkable incident,


False signal on a distress frequency? Possible fine of $10,000 if the owner
turns it on again? Somewhat remarkable to me.


and certainly not a reason to make snide innuendo
about "Designed And Built By PROFESSIONALS".


I was simply pointing out that *any* piece of electronics can have problems. I
guess that's not allowed here.

Just like one must not wear shirts with the slogan "Protect Our Civil
Liberties" where President Bush can see them.


Neither is it a reasonable
basis for a jeremiad about the FCC shirking their responsibilities.


I think it is, considering the background of how loose certification has
become.

---

On the subject of "MADE IN CHINA": There was a story in the local paper's
business section about the bottleneck at various West Coast ports, specifically
Long Beach and Los Angeles. Imports from Pacific Rim countries, particularly
China, are arriving at such a rate that ships wait as much as a week to be
unloaded because the port facilities can't handle the flow. New people are
being hired and the facilities expanded, but such expansion takes time.

Of course what's less visible is the flow of money in the opposite direction.

And what is even LESS thought of is their investment in us and propping
of our economy that they are doing.

One of these days man,
And it won't be very long
They gonna own us.

Scares the bejabbers out of me.

- Mike KB3EIA -

Perhaps if the rudder had been larger, the Titanic might have turned away
quicker and missed the berg. But that's really irrelevant. The ship was clearly
going too fast for conditions.


There's also the possibility that the cold water around
there made the steel the ship was constructed with somewhat
brittle. That the metalurgy of steel wasn't that well
controlled or understood back then. And that the batch
of steel used for the hull wasn't as good as it should have
been. And that modern ship builders would never use it
today. That the same ship built with good steel could have
taken that iceberg hit with much less if any damage.

I still wouldn't sail a ship thru iceberg infested waters.

If it happened once, it can happen again. We don't really know what made it
fail that way.


Of course the story makes good news copy on a slow day, but it's hardly
a remarkable incident,


False signal on a distress frequency? Possible fine of $10,000 if the owner
turns it on again? Somewhat remarkable to me.


Stations in distress may only be able to produce QRP level
signals. Thus you want to have *NO* QRM on those frequencies.

If I were the owner I'd unplug it and be screaming at the
manufacturer to come get it and fix or replace it.

In article , Robert Casey
writes:

False signal on a distress frequency? Possible fine of $10,000 if the owner
turns it on again? Somewhat remarkable to me.

One can imagine the reaction when the feds came banging on the door...

Stations in distress may only be able to produce QRP level
signals. Thus you want to have *NO* QRM on those frequencies.

If I were the owner I'd unplug it and be screaming at the
manufacturer to come get it and fix or replace it.

I'd want my money back.

73 de Jim, N2EY

In article , Robert Casey
writes:

Perhaps if the rudder had been larger, the Titanic might have turned away
quicker and missed the berg. But that's really irrelevant. The ship was
clearly
going too fast for conditions.


There's also the possibility that the cold water around
there made the steel the ship was constructed with somewhat
brittle. That the metalurgy of steel wasn't that well
controlled or understood back then. And that the batch
of steel used for the hull wasn't as good as it should have
been. And that modern ship builders would never use it
today. That the same ship built with good steel could have
taken that iceberg hit with much less if any damage.

More than a possibility, it's been documented from samples brought up from the
wreck. Lot of sulfur in that steel.

Perhaps what makes the Titanic disaster so intriguing is that there were so
many seemingly-small factors that contributed. The lack of even one of these
small factors could have averted the sinking, or at least the loss of life.

For example:

If the lookouts had binoculars, they probably would have seen the berg sooner,
and the attempt to steer around it would have been successful. (The binoculars
were locked in the second officers' cabin, but neither he nor the other
officers knew it at the time. Still there).

If any of the six ice warnings had been heeded, and speed reduced just a bit,
the attempt to steer around the berg would have been successful.

If the first officer had not tried to steer around the berg, the ship would
have stayed afloat.

If there had been lifeboat space for all, all could have been saved. (The
design of the Olympic class could accomodate enough lifeboats - special davits
were used that allowed more lifeboats, by stacking them on the boat deck. But
lifeboats cost money, took up deck space, and everyone thought they'd never be
used. So the full number were not provided. After the disaster, sister ships
Olympic and Britannic were equipped with adequate lifeboats by simply reverting
to the original plan).

If there had been 24 hour radio watch required, the nearby Californian could
have saved most if not all who perished.

If Titanic had used a standard distress flare signal, (I don't think such a
signal existed in April 1912) the nearby Californian could have saved most if
not all who perished.

If better steel, a bigger rudder, higher bulkheads, double hull (not just a
double bottom), or higher capacity pumps had been used, the disaster could have
been avoided or the ship kept afloat long enough for all to be saved.

If the officer on the Californian who knew Morse Code and who used to listen in
when "Sparks" was off duty had remembered to wind up the magnetic detector, he
would have heard the distress calls and Californian could have saved most if
not all who perished. But he forgot and heard nothing.

I still wouldn't sail a ship thru iceberg infested waters.

Not at full speed with inadequate lookout capability and a big, slow turning
ship!

Which proves the point: Titanic was not being operated properly for the
conditions encountered. Other ships had stopped completely, or were proceeding
at greatly reduced speed, because of the ice.

73 de Jim, N2EY

Subject: Designed And Built By PROFESSIONALS....
From: PAMNO (N2EY)
Date: 10/20/2004 3:57 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

Perhaps what makes the Titanic disaster so intriguing is that there were so
many seemingly-small factors that contributed. The lack of even one of these
small factors could have averted the sinking, or at least the loss of life.

That's why they call the events leading up to a mishap "the chain of
events"...Becasue if even one link in the chain had been broken, the chances of
the incident occuring would have been reduced.

73

Steve, K4YZ

Mike Coslo wrote in message ...
N2EY wrote:
---

On the subject of "MADE IN CHINA": There was a story in the local paper's
business section about the bottleneck at various West Coast ports, specifically
Long Beach and Los Angeles. Imports from Pacific Rim countries, particularly
China, are arriving at such a rate that ships wait as much as a week to be
unloaded because the port facilities can't handle the flow. New people are
being hired and the facilities expanded, but such expansion takes time.

Of course what's less visible is the flow of money in the opposite direction.

And what is even LESS thought of is their investment in us and propping
of our economy that they are doing.

That's what I was trying to say, I think.

One of these days man,
And it won't be very long
They gonna own us.

In some ways they already do.

Try to buy a new computer that's American made. Or many other items.
The brand name may be USA but the "Made In XXX" label tells the facts.

It's "good for business/the economy" in the short run because the
prices are lower. But in the long run, we're not going to have the
American Dream by manufacturing only weapons, high tech stuff, and
taking in each other's washing.

Scares the bejabbers out of me.

Me too.

73 de Jim, N2EY

PAMNO (N2EY) wrote in message ...
In article ,
(Brian Kelly) writes:

(N2EY) wrote in message
...
In article t,
"Dan/W4NTI"
w4nti@get rid of this mindspring.com writes:

Was not the Titanic designed and built by professionals?

Yes - but there was nothing wrong with its design and construction. In
fact, it
carried more lifeboats, and employed more modern safety equipment, than was
required by regulations at the time.

The Titanic's problem was improper operation. Steaming full speed into an
ice
field on a cold, calm, moonless night after receiving no less than six
warnings
of ice ahead was simply reckless. Doing so when the lookouts had no
binoculars
was even more reckless.

Trying to turn away, and in doing so exposing the side of the ship to the
danger, was the final mistake. That action can be understood, however,
because
the decision to do it was made in haste. (Later analysis showed that had
the
First Officer simply reversed engines and hit the 'berg head-on, the ship
would
have stayed afloat and few if any lives would have been lost).

No officer in their right mind is going to plow straight ahead into an
iceberg to "save the ship".

Sure they would - if they knew that the ship could not turn in time, and would
sink as a result.

That's a pair of compounded far-fetched what-if's which defy common
sense. I'm not into endless streams of what-if's, they can go anywhere
as has been the case for 92 years so far in the case of the loss of
the Titanic and "prove" nothing. We're into an engineering screwup
here, not what-if's.

You stated "there was nothing wrong with its (Titanic's)design and
construction." My position is that the Titanic apparently did have a
major design flaw which led directly to it's loss, it's rudder was
undersized.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/society...tanic_02.shtml

The rudder was grossly undersized so the
Titanic did not respond to the helm soon enough and swiped the ice.

Titanic's sister ship, Olympic, was essentiaaly the same ship. A few feet
shorter and less luxurious, but the same basic design. Olympic went into
service first, and much of her crew was transferred to Titanic because of their
experience.

No complaints of a grossly undersized rudder.

See above link. Argue with them.

Other ships of that era with properly designed rudders would have
turned away from the berg and missed it with room to spare.

Perhaps if the rudder had been larger, the Titanic might have turned away
quicker and missed the berg. But that's really irrelevant.
The ship was clearly
going too fast for conditions.

There's no "might have beens" about it. Unless you can explain why a
larger rudder wouldn't have turned the Titanic quicker so that it
missed the berg.

73 de Jim, N2EY

w3rv

"N2EY" wrote

Would you be willing to work for what your Chinese counterpart is
paid? And
work under his conditions?

Would you be willing to repeal most environmental, safety, and
child-labor
laws? How about intellectual-property protection?

That's all a red-herring of Andersonesque proportions and you know it.
(If you don't know it, then enroll in a basic global economics class at
your local Community College.)

73, de Hans, K0HB

PAMNO (N2EY) wrote in message ...
In article t, "KØHB"
writes:

"N2EY" wrote

On the subject of "MADE IN CHINA": There was a story in the local
paper's
business section about the bottleneck at various West Coast ports,
specifically
Long Beach and Los Angeles. Imports from Pacific Rim countries,
particularly
China, are arriving at such a rate that ships wait as much as a week
to be
unloaded because the port facilities can't handle the flow. New people
are
being hired and the facilities expanded, but such expansion takes
time.

Of course what's less visible is the flow of money in the opposite
direction.

If US manufacturers don't want the business at that price, then they
have no reason to whine when an offshore firm does.

Would you be willing to work for what your Chinese counterpart is paid? And
work under his conditions?

Would you be willing to repeal most environmental, safety, and child-labor
laws? How about intellectual-property protection?

So what's your solution? Shut off Pacific Rim imports and "Buy
American"? Then cheerfully pay maybe $2,000 for a 21" Motorola TV
rcvr? Or do you actually think that by shutting down imports from
China we can "reform" them?


I wouldn't.

73 de Jim, N2EY

w3rv