Anyone here with "in-depth" knowledge of the Bearcat 250 Scanner and
repairs? I am way out of tune with these things. Haven't seen one - let
alone worked on one for close to 10 years if not much longer. I have a model
here just came in the door for repair. I've had a manual from days gone by.
There appears to be some differences - not shown in the manual. I'm
wondering if I can pick someone's brains about this model or it's
differences.

1. Was there more than one version of service manual? At the time I
purchased this, I don't believe I was told of anymore than the one - I
usually ask about revisions.

2. Did the updates in this model produce differences in circuitry (I'm sure
they probably did) - and how?

3. The issue I "currently" see - is I have "low level" audio, no squelch
action, no receive, no display, no dot. I started troubleshooting it and
this book has a Q206 listed in it as providing a particular voltage to the
circuit (can't recall which part of the circuit - without the book in front
of me). THIS unit shows NO Q206 where the book shows it to be. I can be more
specific in parts layout in that area if someone asks - but for now - I'm
missing some voltage and need to find out why Q206 is not there OR whatever.
The "Q204" is putting out like 4 - 6 volts less than it should. I'm not sure
that is the "only" issue here - but the first I found thus far. I'm just
trying to clear up the mystery of Q206 for the moment. The book shows it
"supposedly" on the "Features" board. Along with that issue, there is in the
same leg of circuit - according to my manual - a 47K ohm resistor there tied
to Q204 and a wire coming from the 18V supply - with an 9v Zener in that
area also. This model has a 1xxxx ohm resistor there OR at least it appears
to. It is burned in the center from heat - but the first band is clearly
"brown" - so this isn't the 47K as called for in my manual. Basically, the
circuit leg is all there - minus Q206! There's not even a place for it "to"
be, from what I'm seeing.

IF I'm in error of voltages/values specified - its' only I'm going from
memory - the book is in the shop - but I"m not off in my description
otherwise.

I can provide more specific info such as Serial Number, Board numbers and/or
revisions, whatever - if requested, I just don't have it in front of me at
the moment.

I realize some parts of this radio are impossible to get now-days - so - I
want to make sure I can trace this down to something repairable and get it
done OR find out quick it isn't possible and hand it back without wasting
much more time.

Any info? Please answer here - my address is a spam catcher only.

Thanks,

Lou

Lou,

Not wishing to appear rude, but if you have to spend this much time on a 10
year old model is it worth repairing or should it be written off as beyond
economical repair.

Dave

"Dave Healey" wrote in message
...
Lou,

Not wishing to appear rude, but if you have to spend this much time on a
10 year old model is it worth repairing or should it be written off as
beyond economical repair.

Dave


Dave,

You're not being rude..... Trust me, the thought crossed my mind........ but
it is for a good friend of mine - as a favor. I did tell them that "some"
parts are no longer available and it might be time to toss it. But, I didn't
want to just toss it without the ole "college try". Any time I ever needed
any help - they were quick to jump to my aid, so I'd like to try to return
the favor - especially now that they are blind - due to diabetes. Were it
not for that - it would have probably been handed back immediately - with an
I"m sorry. I waste valuable time on misadventures of my own - so I can't be
too much for the wear and tear for the little time I've spent on this to
date. I would much rather do this for a good friend than to lift a finger
for half of my idiotic relatives. I'm sure you know how that works out.

Thanks just the same for your reply.

Lou

Dave,

You're not being rude..... Trust me, the thought crossed my mind........
but it is for a good friend of mine - as a favor. I did tell them that
"some" parts are no longer available and it might be time to toss it. But,
I didn't want to just toss it without the ole "college try". Any time I
ever needed any help - they were quick to jump to my aid, so I'd like to
try to return the favor - especially now that they are blind - due to
diabetes. Were it not for that - it would have probably been handed back
immediately - with an I"m sorry. I waste valuable time on misadventures of
my own - so I can't be too much for the wear and tear for the little time
I've spent on this to date. I would much rather do this for a good friend
than to lift a finger for half of my idiotic relatives. I'm sure you know
how that works out.

Thanks just the same for your reply.

Lou

Lou,
Having read the above I'm sorry I can't help you with any info on it and I
see your perfectly good reason for carrying on.
Regards
Dave

Lou -

http://www.notpurfect.com/main/bearcat.html

I assume that you have gone through these repair FAQ steps? (complied by Bob
Parnass from 1999)
http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_BC_Repair.html
http://www.scancat.com/newbscn.html

BTW, I always start with the power supply section ---
looking closely at electrolytic capacitors, diodes, etc.

- Bearcat 250 heat problem. Kit includes power transformer, regulator,
and instructions to cure overheating problems.
G&G COMMUNICATIONS
Gerry Oliver - Owner
7825 Black Street Rd., LeRoy, N.Y. 14482
Phone: 585-768-8151 / Fax: 585-768-7175
http://www.iinc.com/ggcomm/mods.html

http://www.scannermaster.com/Product...Code=01-550787

The Electra/Bearcat BC350, BC300, BC250, BC220, BC20/20,
BC211, BC210, and BC210XL models were hand assembled, and
every one I've serviced had several connections that were
either soldered poorly, or not soldered at all.

Resoldering joints on the ribbon cable connecting the RF
and keyboard logic circuit boards in a BC250 attenuated the
microprocessor/synthesizer hash noise noticeably.
http://www.firecommunications.com/sample/bearcat.txt


gb

"Radiosrfun" wrote in message
...
Anyone here with "in-depth" knowledge of the Bearcat 250 Scanner and
repairs? I am way out of tune with these things. Haven't seen one - let
alone worked on one for close to 10 years if not much longer. I have a
model here just came in the door for repair. I've had a manual from days
gone by. There appears to be some differences - not shown in the manual.
I'm wondering if I can pick someone's brains about this model or it's
differences.

1. Was there more than one version of service manual? At the time I
purchased this, I don't believe I was told of anymore than the one - I
usually ask about revisions.

2. Did the updates in this model produce differences in circuitry (I'm
sure they probably did) - and how?

3. The issue I "currently" see - is I have "low level" audio, no squelch
action, no receive, no display, no dot. I started troubleshooting it and
this book has a Q206 listed in it as providing a particular voltage to the
circuit (can't recall which part of the circuit - without the book in
front of me). THIS unit shows NO Q206 where the book shows it to be. I can
be more specific in parts layout in that area if someone asks - but for
now - I'm missing some voltage and need to find out why Q206 is not there
OR whatever. The "Q204" is putting out like 4 - 6 volts less than it
should. I'm not sure that is the "only" issue here - but the first I found
thus far. I'm just trying to clear up the mystery of Q206 for the moment.
The book shows it "supposedly" on the "Features" board. Along with that
issue, there is in the same leg of circuit - according to my manual - a
47K ohm resistor there tied to Q204 and a wire coming from the 18V
supply - with an 9v Zener in that area also. This model has a 1xxxx ohm
resistor there OR at least it appears to. It is burned in the center from
heat - but the first band is clearly "brown" - so this isn't the 47K as
called for in my manual. Basically, the circuit leg is all there - minus
Q206! There's not even a place for it "to" be, from what I'm seeing.

IF I'm in error of voltages/values specified - its' only I'm going from
memory - the book is in the shop - but I"m not off in my description
otherwise.

I can provide more specific info such as Serial Number, Board numbers
and/or revisions, whatever - if requested, I just don't have it in front
of me at the moment.

I realize some parts of this radio are impossible to get now-days - so - I
want to make sure I can trace this down to something repairable and get it
done OR find out quick it isn't possible and hand it back without wasting
much more time.

Any info? Please answer here - my address is a spam catcher only.

Thanks,

Lou

Hi,

I have "I believe" - all of his info downloaded and have reviewed it. I'm
going to check your links to be sure I have all. I "usually" do start with
the power supply in any case - unless symptoms guide me elsewhere. In this
case in particular - being "almost" dead - that was the "first" place I
headed. Situation is - I am at a component which is producing less than it
should - and I look to changing it, but in the manual - there is a
transistor shown in the same circuit along with a zener. The zener is
there - the other transistor Q206 "appears" to not have been placed there.
Was just trying to find out what is with that. I'll look again - but it
didn't appear to be on the bottom of the board - and "all" (as I can see
them) traces of the parts shown interconnect on top minus Q206.
So - was wondering of any changes, etc. And then too - the resistor which
was burned in the center is showing with the first band (not discolored) to
not be as listed in the book. Well anyway, I'll replace the transistor which
isn't pumping out enough and see what it does for me. I can't make out the
resistor other than the first band, so I'll stick one in which the book
called for - and see what goes on. I'll study the thing to see what was in
their mind - then I'll go from there. I've wasted better time on my own so -
trying to help a friend - won't bother me. If I"m not doing this, I'll be
playing taxi driver for family. Would rather play at the bench!

Lou

"w9gb" wrote in message
. ..
Lou -

http://www.notpurfect.com/main/bearcat.html

I assume that you have gone through these repair FAQ steps? (complied by
Bob Parnass from 1999)
http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_BC_Repair.html
http://www.scancat.com/newbscn.html

BTW, I always start with the power supply section ---
looking closely at electrolytic capacitors, diodes, etc.

- Bearcat 250 heat problem. Kit includes power transformer, regulator,
and instructions to cure overheating problems.
G&G COMMUNICATIONS
Gerry Oliver - Owner
7825 Black Street Rd., LeRoy, N.Y. 14482
Phone: 585-768-8151 / Fax: 585-768-7175
http://www.iinc.com/ggcomm/mods.html

http://www.scannermaster.com/Product...Code=01-550787

The Electra/Bearcat BC350, BC300, BC250, BC220, BC20/20,
BC211, BC210, and BC210XL models were hand assembled, and
every one I've serviced had several connections that were
either soldered poorly, or not soldered at all.

Resoldering joints on the ribbon cable connecting the RF
and keyboard logic circuit boards in a BC250 attenuated the
microprocessor/synthesizer hash noise noticeably.
http://www.firecommunications.com/sample/bearcat.txt


gb

"Radiosrfun" wrote in message
...
Anyone here with "in-depth" knowledge of the Bearcat 250 Scanner and
repairs? I am way out of tune with these things. Haven't seen one - let
alone worked on one for close to 10 years if not much longer. I have a
model here just came in the door for repair. I've had a manual from days
gone by. There appears to be some differences - not shown in the manual.
I'm wondering if I can pick someone's brains about this model or it's
differences.

1. Was there more than one version of service manual? At the time I
purchased this, I don't believe I was told of anymore than the one - I
usually ask about revisions.

2. Did the updates in this model produce differences in circuitry (I'm
sure they probably did) - and how?

3. The issue I "currently" see - is I have "low level" audio, no squelch
action, no receive, no display, no dot. I started troubleshooting it and
this book has a Q206 listed in it as providing a particular voltage to
the circuit (can't recall which part of the circuit - without the book in
front of me). THIS unit shows NO Q206 where the book shows it to be. I
can be more specific in parts layout in that area if someone asks - but
for now - I'm missing some voltage and need to find out why Q206 is not
there OR whatever. The "Q204" is putting out like 4 - 6 volts less than
it should. I'm not sure that is the "only" issue here - but the first I
found thus far. I'm just trying to clear up the mystery of Q206 for the
moment. The book shows it "supposedly" on the "Features" board. Along
with that issue, there is in the same leg of circuit - according to my
manual - a 47K ohm resistor there tied to Q204 and a wire coming from the
18V supply - with an 9v Zener in that area also. This model has a 1xxxx
ohm resistor there OR at least it appears to. It is burned in the center
from heat - but the first band is clearly "brown" - so this isn't the 47K
as called for in my manual. Basically, the circuit leg is all there -
minus Q206! There's not even a place for it "to" be, from what I'm
seeing.

IF I'm in error of voltages/values specified - its' only I'm going from
memory - the book is in the shop - but I"m not off in my description
otherwise.

I can provide more specific info such as Serial Number, Board numbers
and/or revisions, whatever - if requested, I just don't have it in front
of me at the moment.

I realize some parts of this radio are impossible to get now-days - so -
I want to make sure I can trace this down to something repairable and get
it done OR find out quick it isn't possible and hand it back without
wasting much more time.

Any info? Please answer here - my address is a spam catcher only.

Thanks,

Lou

"Radiosrfun" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I have "I believe" - all of his info downloaded and have reviewed it. I'm
going to check your links to be sure I have all. I "usually" do start with
the power supply in any case - unless symptoms guide me elsewhere. In this
case in particular - being "almost" dead - that was the "first" place I
headed. Situation is - I am at a component which is producing less than it
should - and I look to changing it, but in the manual - there is a
transistor shown in the same circuit along with a zener. The zener is
there - the other transistor Q206 "appears" to not have been placed there.
Was just trying to find out what is with that. I'll look again - but it
didn't appear to be on the bottom of the board - and "all" (as I can see
them) traces of the parts shown interconnect on top minus Q206.
So - was wondering of any changes, etc. And then too - the resistor which
was burned in the center is showing with the first band (not discolored)
to not be as listed in the book. Well anyway, I'll replace the transistor
which isn't pumping out enough and see what it does for me. I can't make
out the resistor other than the first band, so I'll stick one in which the
book called for - and see what goes on. I'll study the thing to see what
was in their mind - then I'll go from there. I've wasted better time on my
own so - trying to help a friend - won't bother me. If I"m not doing this,
I'll be playing taxi driver for family. Would rather play at the bench!

Lou

Seems like you might have a very early production radio that just doesn't
have Q206. The date code on the back of the radio might confirm this.

The circuit is just an amplified Zener regulator and it isn't extremely
critical if the amplifier is one transistor or two. The service manual shows
a 8.2V Zener and you mentioned having a 9.1V Zener in the radio so they
evidently didn't intend to put Q206 in the circuit. Replace Q204 and add a
small heatsink to keep it from burning out again. The resistor may look like
band one is brown, but heat can change an orange band to brown over time.
Try a 470 Ohm resistor initially. If the output voltage is too far below
8.4V, the Zener is being starved and the resistor will have to be reduced.
In that case try 330 Ohms and measure the output again.

"Frank346" wrote in message
...

"Radiosrfun" wrote in message
...
Hi,

I have "I believe" - all of his info downloaded and have reviewed it. I'm
going to check your links to be sure I have all. I "usually" do start
with the power supply in any case - unless symptoms guide me elsewhere.
In this case in particular - being "almost" dead - that was the "first"
place I headed. Situation is - I am at a component which is producing
less than it should - and I look to changing it, but in the manual -
there is a transistor shown in the same circuit along with a zener. The
zener is there - the other transistor Q206 "appears" to not have been
placed there. Was just trying to find out what is with that. I'll look
again - but it didn't appear to be on the bottom of the board - and "all"
(as I can see them) traces of the parts shown interconnect on top minus
Q206.
So - was wondering of any changes, etc. And then too - the resistor which
was burned in the center is showing with the first band (not discolored)
to not be as listed in the book. Well anyway, I'll replace the transistor
which isn't pumping out enough and see what it does for me. I can't make
out the resistor other than the first band, so I'll stick one in which
the book called for - and see what goes on. I'll study the thing to see
what was in their mind - then I'll go from there. I've wasted better time
on my own so - trying to help a friend - won't bother me. If I"m not
doing this, I'll be playing taxi driver for family. Would rather play at
the bench!

Lou

Seems like you might have a very early production radio that just doesn't
have Q206. The date code on the back of the radio might confirm this.

The circuit is just an amplified Zener regulator and it isn't extremely
critical if the amplifier is one transistor or two. The service manual
shows a 8.2V Zener and you mentioned having a 9.1V Zener in the radio so
they evidently didn't intend to put Q206 in the circuit. Replace Q204 and
add a small heatsink to keep it from burning out again. The resistor may
look like band one is brown, but heat can change an orange band to brown
over time. Try a 470 Ohm resistor initially. If the output voltage is too
far below 8.4V, the Zener is being starved and the resistor will have to
be reduced. In that case try 330 Ohms and measure the output again.


THANK YOU - very much................. I'll look at the band again, you may
be right - it "was" late! Yeah, I've seen this before - quite a bit in other
radios. But the rest was as stated. As to the Zener - I may be in error -
the book "shows" an 8.2 vdc. I seen the schematic was calling for 9.1 vdc
off one leg of one of the transistors and that stuck in my head. I'll have
to remeasure that too as it seems to me I may just have gotten 9.1 +/- vdc.
I didn't make notes as I usually do.

I'll give this a whirl since I know definately the voltage is "way" off on
the transistor. But as I said - I simply stopped there to try to find out
what the heck was going on with the missing transistor.

I definately have to make notes on this one - regardless if it is fixed or
not - JUST in case!

Thanks again..........

Lou

"Radiosrfun" wrote in message
...
Anyone here with "in-depth" knowledge of the Bearcat 250 Scanner and
repairs?

The service manual you have is the only one I know of. Scanner manufacturers
never update the manuals until there is a catalog number or model number
change.

During the life of a product there are changes made in production. I have an
Electra schematic (engineering drawing) for the BC300 and it went through a
dozen changes at the time the drawing was made. Finding a drawing like this
for the 250 would be nearly impossible now.

Electra often tack-soldered parts to the back of the boards. Maybe Q206 is
on the back in your 250.

Q206 serves as an amplifier to reduce the current in the Zener and improve
regulation. If the voltage at the emitter of Q204 is much less than 8.4
volts, a good portion of the circuitry in the radio will not operate. You
can try replacing the Q204 regulator with a 9 volt three terminal regulator
feeding into a 1 amp diode. That should give you about 8.4 volts and has the
bonus of overcurrent and thermal protection. The original design ran Q204
way too hot and it is a common failure point. Adding a heatsink and drilling
a few vent holes helps.

Many of the IC's in the radio are custom and very hard to find if one needs
to be replaced. When I had a 250, I recall it being very sensitive to
disturbances on the AC line, often hanging the scan cycle or corrupting the
programming.

With all the negatives about the 250, I'd look for a more recent model on
Ebay to replace it. Something simple with 50 or 100 channels should be
available cheap and it will perform better than the 250 ever did.

"Frank346" wrote in message
...

"Radiosrfun" wrote in message
...
Anyone here with "in-depth" knowledge of the Bearcat 250 Scanner and
repairs?

The service manual you have is the only one I know of. Scanner
manufacturers never update the manuals until there is a catalog number or
model number change.

During the life of a product there are changes made in production. I have
an Electra schematic (engineering drawing) for the BC300 and it went
through a dozen changes at the time the drawing was made. Finding a
drawing like this for the 250 would be nearly impossible now.

Electra often tack-soldered parts to the back of the boards. Maybe Q206 is
on the back in your 250.

Q206 serves as an amplifier to reduce the current in the Zener and improve
regulation. If the voltage at the emitter of Q204 is much less than 8.4
volts, a good portion of the circuitry in the radio will not operate. You
can try replacing the Q204 regulator with a 9 volt three terminal
regulator feeding into a 1 amp diode. That should give you about 8.4 volts
and has the bonus of overcurrent and thermal protection. The original
design ran Q204 way too hot and it is a common failure point. Adding a
heatsink and drilling a few vent holes helps.

Many of the IC's in the radio are custom and very hard to find if one
needs to be replaced. When I had a 250, I recall it being very sensitive
to disturbances on the AC line, often hanging the scan cycle or corrupting
the programming.

With all the negatives about the 250, I'd look for a more recent model on
Ebay to replace it. Something simple with 50 or 100 channels should be
available cheap and it will perform better than the 250 ever did.


Therein lays "part" of the problem... Q204's voltage is ok at input but
significantly slacks off on output. MY issue at the moment is - the book
"shows" a Q206 - but there is not one there! IF you have the manual - refer
to it - you'll see the 9v zener etc, there. ALL is there but Q206. It is
weird.......
It doesn't appear to have been "placed" there to begin with.

I was shooting for trying to figure that out - then finish troubleshooting.
As for someone's posting of starting with the power supply, that is exactly
what I've been doing til I ran into parts not there - as shown. That is
usually where I start - with ANY issues I have unless directed otherwise by
symptoms.
I was eliminating all the parts as the book lists as suspects. I believe I'm
in a definate problem area with the voltages - but still - where the hell
did Q206 disappear to? IF there is no other info to be had, I'll take a nice
LONG look at it in the morning and see if there is something else I can work
out. I'm 99.9% sure I have a new Q204 to pop in if this one is weak. I just
stopped where I was to try to figure out what the heck was going on.

I've researched most of the info - if not all - available by Parness(sp?) -
that I could find. I'll just take a good close look tomorrow and see what is
what. Was just hanging back to see what replies I might get to help out.

THANK YOU FOLKS for your input.

Lou