RHF wrote:

Tom-K-in-LA,

First lets take a look at the two Shortwave Listener Antennas :
{ Lets Reason Things Out form a Practical Point of View. }

Situation : Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna
-versus- RF Systems T2FD {Passive} Shortwave Antenna
that is rolled-up and placed on the same Window as the
Sony had been located in an Apartment.

The Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna is an
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/3676.html
"E" Probe type of Antenna using a relatively small size
Antenna Element* and an Impedance Matching Amplifier


A loop antenna is NOT an e-probe.

Rest of nonsense deleted.

On Mar 17, 5:36 am, joe wrote:
- - RHF -wrote-
- - Tom-K-in-LA,
- -
- - First lets take a look at the two Shortwave Listener Antennas :
- - { Lets Reason Things Out form a Practical Point of View. }
- -
- - Situation : Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna
- - -versus- RF Systems T2FD {Passive} Shortwave Antenna
- - that is rolled-up and placed on the same Window as the
- - Sony had been located in an Apartment.
- -
- - The Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna is an
- - http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/3676.html
- - "E" Probe type of Antenna using a relatively small size
- - Antenna Element* and an Impedance Matching Amplifier
- -

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
-
So under this 'screen-name' of "Joe" you have a total of
Five (5) posts here since March 4 2008. Which leads
me to believe that you are a Sock-Puppet for some one
else who frequents the RRS Newsgroup.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

=WRT= T2FD Antenna Experts Please Chime In
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...e82457c7f6094c

Joe -wrote- "A loop antenna is NOT an e-probe."

Joe,

The Electric-Field "E" Probe View-Point
"It can be rigged as a VERY directional E probe"
http://www.radiocom.net/

The Magnetic-Field "H" Probe View-Point
"The Broadband Loop is balanced antenna and responds
primarily to the magnetic-field, this ensures high rejection
of nearby electric-fields. The intensity of the electric-field
is usually higher than the magnetic-field when an antenna
is close to interference sources"
http://brneurosci.org/radio-misc.html

"The Loop antenna responds primarily to the Magnetic-Field
and rejects locally radiated Electric-Field noise providing far
lower noise reception than active whip/dipole antennas."
http://brneurosci.org/radio-misc.html

1 - Either way the Single Turn Loop Antenna Element
that is a small Fraction of a Wave-Length Long is a
"Probe" type of Antenna.

2 - When that Loop Antenna Element is 'connected' to
an Amplifier {Active} placed directly at the Element; and
that Amplifier is 'connected' to a Coax Cable feed-in-line :
The Resulting Antenna is an Impedance Matched and
Amplified "Probe" type of Antenna.

3 - Sony AN-LP1 Portable Active Antenna could be
called a Narrow-Banded {Un-Tuned} Loop Antenna.
http://cgi.ebay.com/_W0QQitemZ140214066985
The Control Box is equipped with a Frequency Band
{Narrow Range} Selection Knob : ~4 MHz, ~5 MHz,
~6 MHz, ~7 MHz, ~10 MHz, ~12 MHz, ~14 MHz,
~16 MHz, and ~20 MHz This Knob {Switch} allows
the Selection of any of these Bands which cover the
major Shortwave Radio Broadcast Bands. It generally
the Sony AN-LP1 Amplifies "All" the Frequencies
within these Narrow Bands and Attenuates the
Frequencies that are out of the specific Band.
Note - There is NO Fine-Tuning within the Bands.
http://www.universal-radio.com/catal...nt/3676pre.jpg

That-Something-Extra -Read- Joe Carr's Radio Tech-Notes
"Small Loop Antennas" -by- Joseph J. Carr
http://www.dxing.com/tnotes/tnote08.pdf

=WRT= T2FD Antenna Experts Please Chime In
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.r...e82457c7f6094c

Joe -wrote- "Rest of nonsense deleted." - Nonsense* ?

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
The Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna is an
http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/3676.html
+ Antenna Element : 19" x 3.14 = 60 Inches ~ Five Feet of Wire
+ Signal Capture Area : (19"/2)^2 x 3.14 = 283.4 Square Inches
~ Two Square Feet

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
The RF Systems T2FD is a Passive (Non-Amplified)
http://www.rf-systems.nl/pdf/t2fd.pdf
Shortwave Antenna that measures about 45 Feet Long
Tip-to-Tip and about 18 Inches (1.5 Feet) Wide Top-Wire
to Bottom-Wire; and has about 93 Feet of Wire up in the
Air with a Signal Capture Area of 45 x 1.5 = 67.5 Sq. Ft.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
The T2FD Antenna is relatively large and it's Signal Capture
Area is relatively Big -with-respect-to- the Sony AN-LP1;

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
the T2FD Antenna produces a relatively strong level of
RF Signals; and the T2FD Antenna does not require an
Amplifier to provide good RF Signal Levels to a Radio /
Receiver. -P R O V I D E D- That the T2FD Antenna is
Stretched-Out-Fully and Up-in-the-Air.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Tom-K - Your situation has the T2FD Antenna Rolled-Up*
placed in a Window; with may be a Signal Capture Area
of about 3-Feet-by-3-Feet = 9 Square Feet. The Wires
of the T2FD Antenna are not stretched-out froming a Loop
-but- Rolled-Up froming four Coils.
* THIS AIN'T A T2FD - It is a HodgePodge of Crossed Wires
-aka- MishMash of Wires with crossed RF Signal Paths.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Take the time to 'find' the best Window in your Apartment
that the Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna
works in : Best Signals and Lowest Noise.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Question ? Is your Window Sill and Window Frame Metal ?
or Painted / Plastic / Wood Covered Metal ? :
1 - Then keep the Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave
Antenna centered in the Window and away from the Metal.
2 - Then keep the Wires of the RF Systems T2FD Antenna
at least 3~6 Inches away from the Metal.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
First - Nine (9) Square Feet of Signal Capture Area is a
Fraction (1/7th) of 68 Square Feet and you should
Not Expect the same RF Signal Levels.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Second - The Wire Antenna Element is no-longer a
physically shaped balanced Loop (O) -but- a jumble
of Crossed Wires and Signal Paths.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Third - The Wire Antenna Element is no-longer Out
In-the-Air and away from the Homes Envelope of
Man Made Noise : The Wire Antenna Element is
Inside the Appartment and within the Buildings
Envelope of Man Made Noise.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Result : Lower RF Signal Levels plus Higher RF Noise Levels.


joe - hope that his reply ain't nonsense - iane ~ RHF {pomkia}

On Mar 17, 1:07*pm, RHF wrote:
On Mar 17, 5:36 am, joe wrote:
- - RHF -wrote-
- - Tom-K-in-LA,
- -
- - First lets take a look at the two Shortwave Listener Antennas :
- - { Lets Reason Things Out form a Practical Point of View. }
- -
- - Situation : Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna
- - -versus- RF Systems T2FD {Passive} Shortwave Antenna
- - that is rolled-up and placed on the same Window as the
- - Sony had been located in an Apartment.
- -
- - The Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna is an
- -http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/3676.html
- - "E" Probe type of Antenna using a relatively small size
- - Antenna Element* and an Impedance Matching Amplifier
- -

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
-
So under this 'screen-name' of "Joe" you have a total of
Five (5) posts here since March 4 2008. *Which leads
me to believe that you are a Sock-Puppet for some one
else who frequents the RRS Newsgroup.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

=WRT= T2FD Antenna Experts Please Chime Inhttp://groups.google.com/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/a0e82457c7f6094c

Joe -wrote- "A loop antenna is NOT an e-probe."

Joe,

The Electric-Field "E" Probe View-Point
"It can be rigged as a VERY directional E probe"http://www.radiocom.net/

The Magnetic-Field "H" Probe View-Point
"The Broadband Loop is balanced antenna and responds
primarily to the magnetic-field, this ensures high rejection
of nearby electric-fields. The intensity of the electric-field
is usually higher than the magnetic-field when an antenna
is close to interference sources"http://brneurosci.org/radio-misc.html

"The Loop antenna responds primarily to the Magnetic-Field
and rejects locally radiated Electric-Field noise providing far
lower noise reception than active whip/dipole antennas."http://brneurosci.org/radio-misc.html

1 - Either way the Single Turn Loop Antenna Element
that is a small Fraction of a Wave-Length Long is a
"Probe" type of Antenna.

2 - When that Loop Antenna Element is 'connected' to
an Amplifier {Active} placed directly at the Element; and
that Amplifier is 'connected' to a Coax Cable feed-in-line :
The Resulting Antenna is an Impedance Matched and
Amplified "Probe" type of Antenna.

3 - Sony AN-LP1 Portable Active Antenna could be
called a Narrow-Banded {Un-Tuned} Loop Antenna.http://cgi.ebay.com/_W0QQitemZ140214066985
The Control Box is equipped with a Frequency Band
{Narrow Range} Selection Knob : ~4 MHz, ~5 MHz,
~6 MHz, ~7 MHz, ~10 MHz, ~12 MHz, ~14 MHz,
~16 MHz, and ~20 MHz *This Knob {Switch} allows
the Selection of any of these Bands which cover the
major Shortwave Radio Broadcast Bands. *It generally
the Sony AN-LP1 Amplifies "All" the Frequencies
within these Narrow Bands and Attenuates the
Frequencies that are out of the specific Band.
Note - There is NO Fine-Tuning within the Bands.http://www.universal-radio..com/cata...nt/3676pre.jpg

That-Something-Extra -Read- Joe Carr's Radio Tech-Notes
"Small Loop Antennas" -by- Joseph J. Carrhttp://www.dxing.com/tnotes/tnote08.pdf

=WRT= T2FD Antenna Experts Please Chime Inhttp://groups.google.com/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/a0e82457c7f6094c

Joe -wrote- "Rest of nonsense deleted." - Nonsense* ?

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
The Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna is anhttp://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/sw_ant/3676.html
+ Antenna Element : 19" x 3.14 = 60 Inches ~ Five Feet of Wire
+ Signal Capture Area : (19"/2)^2 x 3.14 = 283.4 Square Inches
~ Two Square Feet

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
The RF Systems T2FD is a Passive (Non-Amplified)http://www.rf-systems.nl/pdf/t2fd.pdf
Shortwave Antenna that measures about 45 Feet Long
Tip-to-Tip and about 18 Inches (1.5 Feet) Wide Top-Wire
to Bottom-Wire; and has about 93 Feet of Wire up in the
Air with a Signal Capture Area of 45 x 1.5 = 67.5 Sq. Ft.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
The T2FD Antenna is relatively large and it's Signal Capture
Area is relatively Big -with-respect-to- the Sony AN-LP1;

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
the T2FD Antenna produces a relatively strong level of
RF Signals; and the T2FD Antenna does not require an
Amplifier to provide good RF Signal Levels to a *Radio /
Receiver. -P R O V I D E D- That the T2FD Antenna is
Stretched-Out-Fully and Up-in-the-Air.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Tom-K - Your situation has the T2FD Antenna Rolled-Up*
placed in a Window; with may be a *Signal Capture Area
of about 3-Feet-by-3-Feet = 9 Square Feet. *The Wires
of the T2FD Antenna are not stretched-out froming a Loop
-but- Rolled-Up froming four Coils.
* THIS AIN'T A T2FD - It is a HodgePodge of Crossed Wires
-aka- MishMash of Wires with crossed RF Signal Paths.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Take the time to 'find' the best Window in your Apartment
that the Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave Antenna
works in : Best Signals and Lowest Noise.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Question ? Is your Window Sill and Window Frame Metal ?
or Painted / Plastic / Wood Covered Metal ? :
1 - Then keep the Sony AN-LP1 Active Loop Shortwave
Antenna centered in the Window and away from the Metal.
2 - Then keep the Wires of the RF Systems T2FD Antenna
at least 3~6 Inches away from the Metal.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
First - Nine (9) Square Feet of Signal Capture Area is a
Fraction (1/7th) of 68 Square Feet and you should
Not Expect the same RF Signal Levels.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Second - The Wire Antenna Element is no-longer a
physically shaped balanced Loop (O) -but- a jumble
of Crossed Wires and Signal Paths.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Third - The Wire Antenna Element is no-longer Out
In-the-Air and away from the Homes Envelope of
Man Made Noise : The Wire Antenna Element is
Inside the Appartment and within the Buildings
Envelope of Man Made Noise.

* ? Question Joe - How is this Nonsense ?
Result : Lower RF Signal Levels plus Higher RF Noise Levels.

joe - hope that his reply ain't nonsense - iane ~ RHF {pomkia}
*.
Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antennas Group =http://tinyurl.com/ogvcf
GoTo =http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Shortwave-SWL-Antenna/
*.
RHF's Standard "Shortwave Listener (SWL) Antennas Group"
For a Reduced Message Signature Line Reference Messagehttp://groups.google..com/group/rec.radio.shortwave/msg/411dac3b4a1798e0
*.

Joe -= F Y I =- This "Fisking" was
brought to you by a 'real' FISK ~ RHF
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fisking

In article
,
RHF wrote:

SNIP

Joe -= F Y I =- This "Fisking" was
brought to you by a 'real' FISK ~ RHF
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fisking
.

Get lost Troll.

--
Telamon
Ventura, California

The T2FD antenna is probably the best overall if: it is installed away
from any metallic objects and is fully stretched out according to the
instructions. Have built one some years ago using gauge 10 (an overkill)
electrical wire,a Palomar balun (9:1 ratio) and PVC tubing. Worked
extremely good here in NYC.How high is your location? I believe there is
a minimum heght required and it must be sloped at an angle either 15 or
30 degrees. Very low noise,broadband,good gain-even tried a VHF scanner
and, surprisingly, got good results !