So, folks - When Drake decided to call it quits, did decent SS S-AM
die? The Eton, a few Sony radios (and maybe some future JRC NRD?)
seem to be all that's left - or did I miss something? Grundig no
longer seems interested (why not?) and Icom never really gave it the
effort it deserved. For a fairly easy-to-implement innovation, it
does not seem to show up much...

Bruce Jensen

On Jan 14, 12:20*am, bpnjensen wrote:
So, folks - When Drake decided to call it quits, did decent SS S-AM
die? *The Eton, a few Sony radios (and maybe some future JRC NRD?)
seem to be all that's left - or did I miss something? *Grundig no
longer seems interested (why not?) and Icom never really gave it the
effort it deserved. *For a fairly easy-to-implement innovation, it
does not seem to show up much...

Bruce Jensen

From a long term observation and analysis point of view, it might
seem that the days of constructing and selling traditional radio
reception machinery for the purpose of pure pleasure are almost
disappearing ... How sad! The last and few diehards,e.g. Eton did not
bring any more S-AM into the market lately ( which is still very much
alive,despite all odds! ) beside older models E1XM and G3. The once
very famous and innovative (not anymore) Sony has , for some reason
the tenacity to continue selling it's one and only current SW
portable- 7600GR (great little sidekick); it still includes the sync
detector,amazingly enough. The number 7600 must have some mysterious
significance -it appears to bring good luck in Japan (at least for
Sony).They have been using that model line for the last 27 years!!!
Drake is not interested in HF at this time,after suddenly dropping the
very decent 8-line. Both JRC and Icom have only astronomically-priced
receivers for the super rich buyers,like ...emirs , kings and
oligarhs. Our good old Harris RF is still here and has exceptional
products (rf505,rf550 which I use occasionally) ,but the current
models are either unaffordable or not available to the general public.
Ten-Tec has very good RX-XXX products, somewhat more modestly priced
than the three big aforementioned firms. What is Watkins - Johnson
called today? DRS,I believe .They got sold several times lately.
That's about it, folks.

bpnjensen wrote:
So, folks - When Drake decided to call it quits, did decent SS S-AM
die? The Eton, a few Sony radios (and maybe some future JRC NRD?)
seem to be all that's left - or did I miss something? Grundig no
longer seems interested (why not?) and Icom never really gave it the
effort it deserved. For a fairly easy-to-implement innovation, it
does not seem to show up much...

Bruce Jensen

The K3 has synchronous AM, effortlessly realized in DSP. You need a
base receiver for $1,600, a wide filter for $100 and the General
Coverage filter set. Run you abt $2k.

wrote:

Ten-Tec has very good RX-XXX products, somewhat more modestly priced
than the three big aforementioned firms. What is Watkins - Johnson
called today? DRS,I believe .They got sold several times lately.
That's about it, folks.

Ten-Tec, Elecraft, and FlexRadio make the best receivers in the world.
They are American companies all 3.

On Jan 14, 4:18*am, dave wrote:
bpnjensen wrote:
So, folks - When Drake decided to call it quits, did decent SS S-AM
die? *The Eton, a few Sony radios (and maybe some future JRC NRD?)
seem to be all that's left - or did I miss something? *Grundig no
longer seems interested (why not?) and Icom never really gave it the
effort it deserved. *For a fairly easy-to-implement innovation, it
does not seem to show up much...

Bruce Jensen

The K3 has synchronous AM, effortlessly realized in DSP. *You need a
base receiver for $1,600, *a wide filter for $100 and the General
Coverage filter set. *Run you abt $2k.

Is it, by chance, sideband selectable? Or would it be necessary to
use a passband to (more or less) achieve one side or the other?

Thanks,
BJ

On Jan 14, 4:18*am, dave wrote:
bpnjensen wrote:
So, folks - When Drake decided to call it quits, did decent SS S-AM
die? *The Eton, a few Sony radios (and maybe some future JRC NRD?)
seem to be all that's left - or did I miss something? *Grundig no
longer seems interested (why not?) and Icom never really gave it the
effort it deserved. *For a fairly easy-to-implement innovation, it
does not seem to show up much...

Bruce Jensen

The K3 has synchronous AM, effortlessly realized in DSP. *You need a
base receiver for $1,600, *a wide filter for $100 and the General
Coverage filter set. *Run you abt $2k.

Just took a look-see. Mighty nice, would not need the transceiver
section, but still...

Still did not see how the S-AM is implemented, if at all, since it
seems to not be mentioned on the page. I understand that the 6 kHz AM
filter is required for AM use, and hopefully that general coverage
package would include a 4 kHz. It comes with a 2.7 kHz narrow, which
is about as tight as I'd care to go on AM. I also did not see a
passband control on the rig, so not sure how that function would
work.

The reviews it gets on E-Ham are obviously glowing, so there must be
something to it.

Thanks!

Bruce

bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 14, 4:18 am, dave wrote:
bpnjensen wrote:
So, folks - When Drake decided to call it quits, did decent SS S-AM
die? The Eton, a few Sony radios (and maybe some future JRC NRD?)
seem to be all that's left - or did I miss something? Grundig no
longer seems interested (why not?) and Icom never really gave it the
effort it deserved. For a fairly easy-to-implement innovation, it
does not seem to show up much...
Bruce Jensen
The K3 has synchronous AM, effortlessly realized in DSP. You need a
base receiver for $1,600, a wide filter for $100 and the General
Coverage filter set. Run you abt $2k.

Is it, by chance, sideband selectable? Or would it be necessary to
use a passband to (more or less) achieve one side or the other?

Thanks,
BJ

I haven't played with it. I just have the 400 Hz 8 pole digital mode
roofing filter.

bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 14, 4:18 am, dave wrote:
bpnjensen wrote:
So, folks - When Drake decided to call it quits, did decent SS S-AM
die? The Eton, a few Sony radios (and maybe some future JRC NRD?)
seem to be all that's left - or did I miss something? Grundig no
longer seems interested (why not?) and Icom never really gave it the
effort it deserved. For a fairly easy-to-implement innovation, it
does not seem to show up much...
Bruce Jensen
The K3 has synchronous AM, effortlessly realized in DSP. You need a
base receiver for $1,600, a wide filter for $100 and the General
Coverage filter set. Run you abt $2k.

Just took a look-see. Mighty nice, would not need the transceiver
section, but still...

Still did not see how the S-AM is implemented, if at all, since it
seems to not be mentioned on the page. I understand that the 6 kHz AM
filter is required for AM use, and hopefully that general coverage
package would include a 4 kHz. It comes with a 2.7 kHz narrow, which
is about as tight as I'd care to go on AM. I also did not see a
passband control on the rig, so not sure how that function would
work.

The reviews it gets on E-Ham are obviously glowing, so there must be
something to it.

Thanks!

Bruce

It's a world class receiver. Nothing else comes close for the money.
There are crystal filters and DSP filters. All the detection and
demodulating is done with DSP.

bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 14, 4:18 am, dave wrote:
[...]
The K3 has synchronous AM, effortlessly realized in DSP. You need a
base receiver for $1,600, a wide filter for $100 and the General
Coverage filter set. Run you abt $2k.

Is it, by chance, sideband selectable? Or would it be necessary to
use a passband to (more or less) achieve one side or the other?

Thanks,
BJ



I don't know if the K3 uses phasing selectable-sideband synchronous
detection, or if it requires passband tuning to get a similar effect.

But one should greatly prefer the phasing method, since on AM or DSB
signals it gives a 6 dB advantage over using IF filters, because
using the phasing method with a sync detector cancels the
_interference_ in the opposite sideband, but it does _not_ cancel
the opposite sideband energy of the desired signal.

The reason is that the Q detector contains essentially no audio from
the desired signal (the detector's locally generated carrier is
locked at 90 degrees difference from the real or imputed transmitted
carrier, putting the desired audio into a deep null), and therefore
no cancellation of any part of the desired signal takes place.

It's too bad the Eton and Sony sync detectors don't provide the
option of listening only to the Q channel output. That would provide
the ability to literally listen to what was underneath any DSB/AM
signal. Some amateur experimenters have done this with homebrew
gear, allowing operation in the close vicinity of 500-kW broadcast
invaders of the 40 meter band.

See the article "SSB Q-Channel Communications" for more details:

http://www.antennex.com/preview/Folder01/Nov4/ssb-q.htm


With all good wishes,


Kevin, WB4AAIO.
--
http://kevinalfredstrom.com/

Two 32-bit digital signal processors provide true software-defined
features, along with expansion memory to handle future signal processing
tasks and operating modes. The operator will have full control over any
operating situation, with 8-band receive and transmit EQ, stereo
speaker/soundcard outputs, binaural effects, and advanced noise
reduction. Also included is built-in PSK31, CW, and TTY decode/encode,
so the operator can enjoy the excitement of data communications with or
without a computer. The rig’s rich I/O complement includes an isolated
sound card interface, front/rear mic/phone jacks, dedicated serial I/O,
and band data. An optional module provides transverter in/out and RX
antenna in/out jacks. The latter allow the use of RX-only, in-line
filters for extreme operating environments.
Kevin Alfred Strom wrote:
bpnjensen wrote:
On Jan 14, 4:18 am, dave wrote:
[...]
The K3 has synchronous AM, effortlessly realized in DSP. You need a
base receiver for $1,600, a wide filter for $100 and the General
Coverage filter set. Run you abt $2k.

Is it, by chance, sideband selectable? Or would it be necessary to
use a passband to (more or less) achieve one side or the other?

Thanks,
BJ



I don't know if the K3 uses phasing selectable-sideband synchronous
detection, or if it requires passband tuning to get a similar effect.

But one should greatly prefer the phasing method, since on AM or DSB
signals it gives a 6 dB advantage over using IF filters, because using
the phasing method with a sync detector cancels the _interference_ in
the opposite sideband, but it does _not_ cancel the opposite sideband
energy of the desired signal.

The reason is that the Q detector contains essentially no audio from the
desired signal (the detector's locally generated carrier is locked at 90
degrees difference from the real or imputed transmitted carrier, putting
the desired audio into a deep null), and therefore no cancellation of
any part of the desired signal takes place.

It's too bad the Eton and Sony sync detectors don't provide the option
of listening only to the Q channel output. That would provide the
ability to literally listen to what was underneath any DSB/AM signal.
Some amateur experimenters have done this with homebrew gear, allowing
operation in the close vicinity of 500-kW broadcast invaders of the 40
meter band.

See the article "SSB Q-Channel Communications" for more details:

http://www.antennex.com/preview/Folder01/Nov4/ssb-q.htm


With all good wishes,


Kevin, WB4AAIO.
Two 32-bit digital signal processors provide true software-defined
features, along with expansion memory to handle future signal processing
tasks and operating modes. The operator will have full control over any
operating situation, with 8-band receive and transmit EQ, stereo
speaker/soundcard outputs, binaural effects, and advanced noise
reduction. Also included is built-in PSK31, CW, and TTY decode/encode,
so the operator can enjoy the excitement of data communications with or
without a computer. The rig’s rich I/O complement includes an isolated
sound card interface, front/rear mic/phone jacks, dedicated serial I/O,
and band data. An optional module provides transverter in/out and RX
antenna in/out jacks. The latter allow the use of RX-only, in-line
filters for extreme operating environments.
-eham