Probably very old news. I see that the Yaesu FRG-100 has been
discontinued. I wrote to Radio Netherlands a few years ago when they
prematurely pronounced the FRG-100 dead. I had to write to Yaesu to
confirm that it was still a current offering, then informed that Radio
Netherlands that their information was incorrect. They eventually changed
it to indicate that it was a current model.

Well, that has changed. Yaseu is not listing it on their site as a
current offering anymore, and various references on the internet list it
is discontinued this year.

The passing of a superlative desktop radio is a tragic thing. The world
is being flooded with inexpensive portable models, people that own some
of these and never graduate to a model the likes of the FRG-100 don't
know what their missing. I have the Yaesu FRG-100, the Yaesu FT-840, and
the Icom R-75. (as well as a bevy of portables) They each have their own
virtues and shortcommings.

As of this writing, shortwave is non-existant on the air. The sun has
been up to no good again, and propagation is suffering.

For those of you that have not visited the Space Weather Sites, here are
some links.

http://www.sel.noaa.gov/alerts/alerts_timeline.html
http://www.sel.noaa.gov/today.html

Auroral Activity http://www.sec.noaa.gov/pmap/

http://www.spaceweather.com/


Unrelated to propagation, but interesting
http://www.sundog.clara.co.uk/atoptics/phenom.htm

Soliloquy.

"Soliloquy" wrote in message
. 3.44...
Probably very old news. I see that the Yaesu FRG-100 has been
discontinued. I wrote to Radio Netherlands a few years ago when they
prematurely pronounced the FRG-100 dead. I had to write to Yaesu to
confirm that it was still a current offering, then informed that Radio
Netherlands that their information was incorrect. They eventually changed
it to indicate that it was a current model.

Well, that has changed. Yaseu is not listing it on their site as a
current offering anymore, and various references on the internet list it
is discontinued this year.

The passing of a superlative desktop radio is a tragic thing. The world
is being flooded with inexpensive portable models, people that own some
of these and never graduate to a model the likes of the FRG-100 don't
know what their missing. I have the Yaesu FRG-100, the Yaesu FT-840, and
the Icom R-75. (as well as a bevy of portables) They each have their own
virtues and shortcommings.

As of this writing, shortwave is non-existant on the air. The sun has
been up to no good again, and propagation is suffering.

For those of you that have not visited the Space Weather Sites, here are
some links.

http://www.sel.noaa.gov/alerts/alerts_timeline.html
http://www.sel.noaa.gov/today.html

Auroral Activity http://www.sec.noaa.gov/pmap/

http://www.spaceweather.com/


Unrelated to propagation, but interesting
http://www.sundog.clara.co.uk/atoptics/phenom.htm

Soliloquy.

I have a Icom R-75, a Yaesu Frg-7, and a Frg-7700. How does the 100 compare
to these radios and is it worth getting??

Thanks
Lucky

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:38:39 -0500, starman wrote:



Soliloquy wrote:

PLEASE READ. Computers uses RS-232 signal levels and protocol when you
connect to the serial port. The FRG-100 Requires TTL levels to connect to
it, therefore signal conversions need to take place between the computer
and radio.

DO NOT CONNECT your FRG-100 directly to the serial port, use a compatible
converter, like the Yaesu CT-62 for the FRG-100.

That's strange. Why would they not have designed it with an RS-232
interface?
Because RS-232 levels require voltages that are rarely seen on
transistorized equipment these days. Just about everything except
RS232 run on 3.3 or 5 volts. RS232 levels are + and - 10 volts or so,
and 20ma current loop is often about 100 volts!

Chips like the Max232 exist to deal with precisely this problem...

matt weber wrote in
:

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:38:39 -0500, starman wrote:

That's strange. Why would they not have designed it with an RS-232
interface?
Because RS-232 levels require voltages that are rarely seen on
transistorized equipment these days. Just about everything except
RS232 run on 3.3 or 5 volts. RS232 levels are + and - 10 volts or so,
and 20ma current loop is often about 100 volts!

Chips like the Max232 exist to deal with precisely this problem...


That answers my question as well. I knew not to do it, though I did not
understand why they choose TTL levels. Thanks

Soliloquy

matt weber wrote:

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:38:39 -0500, starman wrote:



Soliloquy wrote:

PLEASE READ. Computers uses RS-232 signal levels and protocol when you
connect to the serial port. The FRG-100 Requires TTL levels to connect to
it, therefore signal conversions need to take place between the computer
and radio.

DO NOT CONNECT your FRG-100 directly to the serial port, use a compatible
converter, like the Yaesu CT-62 for the FRG-100.

That's strange. Why would they not have designed it with an RS-232
interface?
Because RS-232 levels require voltages that are rarely seen on
transistorized equipment these days. Just about everything except
RS232 run on 3.3 or 5 volts. RS232 levels are + and - 10 volts or so,
and 20ma current loop is often about 100 volts!

Chips like the Max232 exist to deal with precisely this problem...

Yes, but why didn't Yaesu implement a proper RS-232 interface like most
table-top receivers have done in recent years? I guess only they can
answer that question.

starman wrote in :


Why don't most cars come standard with tire chains installed? Probably
because most people would have no need for them. The Yaesu FRG-100 Pre-
Dates the R-75 by 7 years. The Yaesu FRG-100 was introduced in 1992, the
Icom R-75 in 1999.

Although it seems like computers have been with us forever, their common
use in terms of being interfaced, by the average Joe, with radios is a
relatively recent phenomenon.

The Yaesu design apparently goes back 13 years. Look here for a little
computer history. http://www.computerhope.com/history/19902000.htm
http://www.computerhope.com/win3x.htm

Notice that the release date for Windows 3.1 was also in 1992. Whoopee,
Windows 3.1, I would guess that those computers had USB ports. No, why
not? Ah, the evolution of the equipment only produced USB ports in later
years.

Perhaps this is why the FRG-100, released in 1992, and no doubt being
designed a few years before that, didn't obsess about converting the CAT
port to Serial Port levels. I believe that the port was there more for
the option of Remote Control operation than computer interface.

My point is that obsessions with extras does not necessarily make for
good equipment. The Yaesu FRG-100 is a solid performer, even without the
additional features of the Icom R-75. For that matter, is there anyone
out there with a fully operational Palstar R-30C, in like new condition,
that they would like to swap for my fully operational R-75, also in like
new condition?

You can't get any more basic than the Palstar R-30C. But it is also a
performer. Gone are all of those seductive buttons and knobs, instead,
the money goes into the quality of the components used throughout. And
most frightening, I don't even know if it has Computer Control options,
"Oh the Humanity"!

http://www.palstar.com/r30.php

Soliloquy


matt weber wrote:

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:38:39 -0500, starman wrote:



Soliloquy wrote:

Yes, but why didn't Yaesu implement a proper RS-232 interface like
most table-top receivers have done in recent years? I guess only they
can answer that question.

Soliloquy wrote:

starman wrote in :

Why don't most cars come standard with tire chains installed? Probably
because most people would have no need for them. The Yaesu FRG-100 Pre-
Dates the R-75 by 7 years. The Yaesu FRG-100 was introduced in 1992, the
Icom R-75 in 1999.

Although it seems like computers have been with us forever, their common
use in terms of being interfaced, by the average Joe, with radios is a
relatively recent phenomenon.

The Yaesu design apparently goes back 13 years. Look here for a little
computer history. http://www.computerhope.com/history/19902000.htm
http://www.computerhope.com/win3x.htm

Notice that the release date for Windows 3.1 was also in 1992. Whoopee,
Windows 3.1, I would guess that those computers had USB ports. No, why
not? Ah, the evolution of the equipment only produced USB ports in later
years.

Perhaps this is why the FRG-100, released in 1992, and no doubt being
designed a few years before that, didn't obsess about converting the CAT
port to Serial Port levels. I believe that the port was there more for
the option of Remote Control operation than computer interface.

My point is that obsessions with extras does not necessarily make for
good equipment. The Yaesu FRG-100 is a solid performer, even without the
additional features of the Icom R-75. For that matter, is there anyone
out there with a fully operational Palstar R-30C, in like new condition,
that they would like to swap for my fully operational R-75, also in like
new condition?

You can't get any more basic than the Palstar R-30C. But it is also a
performer. Gone are all of those seductive buttons and knobs, instead,
the money goes into the quality of the components used throughout. And
most frightening, I don't even know if it has Computer Control options,
"Oh the Humanity"!

http://www.palstar.com/r30.php

Soliloquy

matt weber wrote:

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:38:39 -0500, starman wrote:



Soliloquy wrote:

Yes, but why didn't Yaesu implement a proper RS-232 interface like
most table-top receivers have done in recent years? I guess only they
can answer that question.

I've never used computer control with any receiver I've ever owned and have had
at least modest success in the dx'ing hobby.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

Yeah, I know what you mean. I tried a couple of different computer
control programs on the R-5000. While they both worked and I could
indeed tune around and the pc expanded the number of memories it was
actually more work than just spinning the knob and punching buttons.
And I was forever tracking down computer noise.


dxAce wrote:
Soliloquy wrote:

starman wrote in
:

Why don't most cars come standard with tire chains installed?
Probably
because most people would have no need for them. The Yaesu FRG-100
Pre-
Dates the R-75 by 7 years. The Yaesu FRG-100 was introduced in
1992, the
Icom R-75 in 1999.

Although it seems like computers have been with us forever, their
common
use in terms of being interfaced, by the average Joe, with radios
is a
relatively recent phenomenon.

The Yaesu design apparently goes back 13 years. Look here for a
little
computer history. http://www.computerhope.com/history/19902000.htm
http://www.computerhope.com/win3x.htm

Notice that the release date for Windows 3.1 was also in 1992.
Whoopee,
Windows 3.1, I would guess that those computers had USB ports. No,
why
not? Ah, the evolution of the equipment only produced USB ports in
later
years.

Perhaps this is why the FRG-100, released in 1992, and no doubt
being
designed a few years before that, didn't obsess about converting
the CAT
port to Serial Port levels. I believe that the port was there more
for
the option of Remote Control operation than computer interface.

My point is that obsessions with extras does not necessarily make
for
good equipment. The Yaesu FRG-100 is a solid performer, even
without the
additional features of the Icom R-75. For that matter, is there
anyone
out there with a fully operational Palstar R-30C, in like new
condition,
that they would like to swap for my fully operational R-75, also in
like
new condition?

You can't get any more basic than the Palstar R-30C. But it is also
a
performer. Gone are all of those seductive buttons and knobs,
instead,
the money goes into the quality of the components used throughout.
And
most frightening, I don't even know if it has Computer Control
options,
"Oh the Humanity"!

http://www.palstar.com/r30.php

Soliloquy

matt weber wrote:

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:38:39 -0500, starman
wrote:



Soliloquy wrote:

Yes, but why didn't Yaesu implement a proper RS-232 interface
like
most table-top receivers have done in recent years? I guess only
they
can answer that question.

I've never used computer control with any receiver I've ever owned
and have had
at least modest success in the dx'ing hobby.

dxAce
Michigan
USA

http://www.iserv.net/~n8kdv/dxpage.htm

"Mark S. Holden" wrote:

Soliloquy wrote:

starman wrote in :

Why don't most cars come standard with tire chains installed? Probably
because most people would have no need for them. The Yaesu FRG-100 Pre-
Dates the R-75 by 7 years. The Yaesu FRG-100 was introduced in 1992, the
Icom R-75 in 1999.

Although it seems like computers have been with us forever, their common
use in terms of being interfaced, by the average Joe, with radios is a
relatively recent phenomenon.

The Yaesu design apparently goes back 13 years. Look here for a little
computer history. http://www.computerhope.com/history/19902000.htm
http://www.computerhope.com/win3x.htm

Notice that the release date for Windows 3.1 was also in 1992. Whoopee,
Windows 3.1, I would guess that those computers had USB ports. No, why
not? Ah, the evolution of the equipment only produced USB ports in later
years.

Perhaps this is why the FRG-100, released in 1992, and no doubt being
designed a few years before that, didn't obsess about converting the CAT
port to Serial Port levels. I believe that the port was there more for
the option of Remote Control operation than computer interface.

My point is that obsessions with extras does not necessarily make for
good equipment. The Yaesu FRG-100 is a solid performer, even without the
additional features of the Icom R-75. For that matter, is there anyone
out there with a fully operational Palstar R-30C, in like new condition,
that they would like to swap for my fully operational R-75, also in like
new condition?

You can't get any more basic than the Palstar R-30C. But it is also a
performer. Gone are all of those seductive buttons and knobs, instead,
the money goes into the quality of the components used throughout. And
most frightening, I don't even know if it has Computer Control options,
"Oh the Humanity"!

http://www.palstar.com/r30.php

Soliloquy

matt weber wrote:

On Mon, 24 Jan 2005 03:38:39 -0500, starman wrote:



Soliloquy wrote:

Yes, but why didn't Yaesu implement a proper RS-232 interface like
most table-top receivers have done in recent years? I guess only they
can answer that question.

The RS-232 standard was an "established" standard when the FRG-100 was brought
out, and personal computers were popular long before Windows was introduced.

Odds are they thought they could make more of a profit by selling the RS-232
adapter as an accessory. Lowe did the same thing.

That makes the most business sense. I didn't think there was any valid
technical reason.

starman wrote in :

Dear Mark and Starman, rather than neurose this link into infinity by
reasserting that the RS232 Standard was omitted since Yaesu had an
insidious plot to overthrow the economy by forcing people to buy the
adapter, why don't you offer evidence, in the form of URLs, to pages that
discuss the prevalence of RS232 ports on other similarly priced equipment
of the time?

Visit he http://www.dxing.com/rx/r71a.htm for information on the Icom
R-71 and R-72.

Here's the back of the Icom R-71

http://www.universal-radio.com/catal...vr/r71diar.jpg

Here's the back of the Icom R-72

http://www.universal-radio.com/catal...r/r72rear.html

Apparently their RS232 Jacks fell of before these photos were taken.

Notice they offer an "OPTIONAL" CT-17 CI-V Level converter. Here we go
again, the conspiracy theories will abound, this underhanded manufacturer
must have been trying to destroy the US economy by requiring their
customers to actually buy accessories rather than incorporate them into
the radio, "Oh the Humanity".

Gee, the Drake R8 and the R8A had the RS232 jacks, but they retailed for
$400 more. Isn't that special. You pay more and you get more, what a
concept.

Does the Lowe 150 have an RS232 Jack, I don't think so!

Strange, I thought that this was an elaborate plan by Yaesu?

The proof is in the pudding. Oh, and by the by, for the correct phrase,
please visit he http://ask.yahoo.com/ask/20020903.html

So you can see, the presence of RS232 Jacks, on equipment of that era,
was limited to units retailing for nearly $1000. But why let facts get in
the way of a needless gripe?


"Mark S. Holden" wrote:

The RS-232 standard was an "established" standard when the FRG-100
was brought out, and personal computers were popular long before
Windows was introduced.

Odds are they thought they could make more of a profit by selling the
RS-232 adapter as an accessory. Lowe did the same thing.

That makes the most business sense. I didn't think there was any valid
technical reason.